To my future husband: I know you will be worth the wait!
— Wendy Griffith, Age 53*
Choice addiction is part intoxication with the process of judging suitors, and part fear of missing out on something better. The risk is that a woman can become caught in analysis paralysis while her best real options evaporate. Not all women fall into choice addiction, and for those who do most don’t wallow in this stage forever. Sooner or later, most realize (even if only intuitively) that the rare gem of a man they are so unhurriedly seeking is also being sought out by other women. And once he’s off the market, her next best chance is also being snapped up by another woman who is quicker on the draw. Put bluntly, it eventually dawns on her that:
That bitch is trying to steal my man!
The power in the emotion isn’t in the general shrinking size and quality of the pool of suitors, but the sense that another woman is taking what is rightfully hers. Her thoughts shift from a blissful daydream about the perfect man who is patiently waiting for her to discover him, to the woman on a mission to poach what is hers. Now instead of savoring the power of finding every flaw in an endless stream of suitors, the woman actually starts trying to find her best possible man and march him down the aisle before that other bitch does.
This same kind of analysis paralysis can occur when making other big decisions, like buying a home. Women especially can get stuck looking for a theoretical option that doesn’t exist, rejecting what in reality are their best case choices. Realtor.com has a brilliant marketing campaign tuned perfectly to demolishing real estate choice addiction:
*See the second footnote at the bottom of this post for the calculations behind my estimate of Griffith’s current age, as well as this.
Arranged marriages don’t suffer from this problem.
Just sayin’…..
Are there enough people buying 496K houses that this is a good marketing strategy? DANG! Houses in America.
One of the most important lessons in economics is that information is not free. Finding the perfect spouse amid a population of 7 billion would take longer than you will be alive. Eventually there is a tradeoff between the lost potential information and moving forward. The result of this is that we all “settle” (in marriage, in jobs, in houses): we accept non-idealized outcome in one dimension (the perfect spouse) to realize a better overall outcome (I’m not female and 53 and single). Most people grasp this intuitively, children and many modern women think the ride will go on forever and the fun only stops so they can move on the next ready fun activity. The ability to live with the consequence of foregone information is a key to wisdom and peace.
Captain Capitalism has a similar post where he compares female mate indecision with corporate hiring indecision. Based on the prevalence of women in HR and the type of men they select for, it’s no wonder they are becoming the scourge of the working world.
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“I look around,
leaves are brown
And the sky
is a hazy shade of winter”
~Paul Simon
An aside: Elizabeth Banks (the “celebrity” in the YouTube vid) is disgusting. Raised a Christian, she formally apostatized and renounced her faith in Christ in order to marry a rich Hollywood Jew (who apparently wasn’t willing to marry a shiksa, and so insisted she convert). As a result, she will never have any money worries, and is very successful in the eyes of the world.
For some reason, the phrase “thirty pieces of silver” comes to mind. And something about gaining the whole world but losing your soul…
I have great difficulty hearing clearly exactly what those two women are saying – at least some words seem garbled. Is it just me?
I spend too much time on this and other American sites: the other day I used, in conversation, the term Real Estate and was informed that this was not a term we use, but for the life of me I could not think what our equivalent expression might be.
Some women never have trouble choosing. I was thus much saddened to learn of the tragic death in a house fire in Texas of Barbara Cope – single and childless it seems. I had long known of her, for she, better known as Butter Queen and celebrated in a song of that name provided comfort and support to musicians away from home as they toured their lonely way from Gig to Gig. She was their friend, friend to two thousand such men, she said. Sleeping with every rock star and their roadies she was surely the ultimate in empowered women and all this by the age of twenty-two.
Her shock at the sudden realization that ‘oneitis’ is contingent upon commitment, but that commitment kills ‘oneitis’. Hilarious!
Smh… Same “repeat” cycle.
She needs to *ACCEPT THE WILL OF THE LORD* in her life. Amen.
~ Bro. Jed
@Opus.
Seeing themes today.
I wonder if Simon ever visited Dallas in “A Bridge Over Troubled Butter” kind of way? Eww.
Why would women accept the will of the Lord in their lives when the failures around them are making every excuse for them by blaming women’s sin on men? Failures who are perpetuating the problem and making it even worse, for about 50 years now…
@Opus
Is it just me?
I don’t know. My father claims to have never understood a single word an Englishman has ever said, but the only ones he knows are from the telly.
2000 men by the age of 22. If she started when 16 then the math works out roughly to sexing up one rocker per day for 6 years with Sundays off for church. I guess that’s doable.
— Wendy Griffith, Age 53*
I know this particular situation has been discussed, but reading it again today it dawned on me that if she is among the most genetically gifted and healthiest women in the country; that 53 is still basically half dead. Ladies, you need to move sooner than that if you really mean it.
@LP, I had to stop by my ex’ house last night. She’s 51. At 41 was still a stunner. Ten years after moving out, and nine years after going in front of the judge, and she’s scary looking.
Griffith is as you say, among the most genetically gifted women in the country.
Griffith is as you say, among the most genetically gifted women in the country.
Yep, still pro makeup job hides a lot and she has no business telling other women what to do when she is (1) an extreme outlier in appearance, as in extreme for her age (even given the makeup … her physique is extremely atypical for her age) and (2) she has no husband and never has had one (and we can be sure that at 53 looking how she does she is no virgin). She’s only a danger to the dupes of women who will listen to her, really.
Good question. If women keep on sinning and men have to take all the blame…at what point will women accept the will of the Lord? The first step is repentance of one’s own sins.
A 53 year old woman who has never been married just isn’t a good bet for marriage, or a relationship.
1) She has no first hand experience with making a permanent long term relationship work. Yes, she might have had some years-long relationships. But when you’re not married, getting out of them is easy. It’s not quite as easy as getting out of a marriage.
2) She has never committed her life to another person. Not really.
3) There’s always a reason why an attractive woman couldn’t get a husband before age 30. Maybe marriage wasn’t a priority for her, and she preferred carouseling it. Maybe she spent too much time on her career. Maybe she has mental/emotional issues, addictions, or other personal issues. Maybe she picks the wrong men (which is an indicator of immaturity and low self-knowledge). Or, maybe she’s just a bitch.
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I’ve never been able to name the phenomenon until now Dalrock. Choice Addiction.
I see it in all of the professional woman I work with. Intelligent (on paper), PhD-qualified, and articulate, I have been told throughout life that they are awesome women that I supposed to have, as a young man, pursued as wife material because they’re ”awesome”.
In truth, when you ask them about their lives, their stories are the same: sex with a high school friend in the early teens, living with several lovers, one-night stands in between relationships, well-stamped passports, serial work -the ”career”. Home: none. Husband: none. Savings: none.
The problem with such a woman is that you can’t show her anything. She’s already seen it. You can’t take her anywhere. She’s already been there. You can’t teach her anything. She’s already learned it. While I haven’t had sex with any, I would imagine the same thing applies: You can’t show, teach, discover ANYTHING new together.
When 30 hits, dread settles upon them like a dark cloud. Biology is hitting them hard.Sexual relations aren’t a frivolous game any more. They no longer are attracting male attention as they previously did, and now have to hunt around for what’s left. This leaves them anxious, depressed and unhappy. The lucky ones find someone, who will find out the hard way that he is just there for his money and sperm. The ones ho mistimed it all end up in a pokey studio with cats.
I got married relatively young at 24 to a woman who wasn’t too damaged by liberal life. Yet she too had a lot of what I describe above, and it has taken me a long time to untangle and stabilize my marriage because of it.
but some women can have it all and wait!
only the losers get nothing at 53
Look at NZ’s prime minister
She is now having a baby at 37!!!
Women world over are going to look to her as a model.
The churches here are already praising her partner for being an excellent servant leading househusband ( hard to believe but churches here are actively pushing men to be house husbands)
Single + Hot = Crazy
https://therationalmale.com/2012/04/27/single-hot-crazy/
It’s socially acceptable to shame a man for being a ‘kidult’ if he hasn’t gotten with life’s program – he has an underlying maturity problem – but for women, bucking the ‘program’ is evidence of integrity and independence. This begs the question, if she’s attractive enough to retain male attention, but has never solidified a monogamous relationship is there something wrong with her?
The problem with such a woman is that you can’t show her anything. She’s already seen it. You can’t take her anywhere. She’s already been there. You can’t teach her anything. She’s already learned it. While I haven’t had sex with any, I would imagine the same thing applies: You can’t show, teach, discover ANYTHING new together.
All youse gots now is da Benjamins!!!!! lololllllllLLLLLolollollllllllllllllllllllllllllll
(sorry, channeled a little GBFM there for a moment)
Jeff Strand: Elizabeth Banks … renounced her faith in Christ in order to marry a rich Hollywood Jew (who apparently wasn’t willing to marry a shiksa, and so insisted she convert).
She’s still a shiksa. That’s likely important to her Jewish husband.
Living in Los Angeles, with connections to the “Hollywood community,” I’ve noticed this among many Jewish men, who prefer shiksas to Jewish women, but then want these shiksas to convert. Practically none of these Jewish men are religious.
It’s both a sexual and a tribal thing. Jewish radio host Barry Farber once said that Jewish men are sexually attracted to Christian women because they’re “forbidden fruit.” They are exotic. Philip Roth made the same observation, as have other Jews.
But Jews are also tribal. Jewishness is more a tribal than a religious thing. There’s even a Jewish magazine here in Los Angeles called Tribe.
Thus, many secular Jewish men want an exotic shiksa wife for sex, but also want her to join his tribe, thus becoming full his. (As an extra bonus, it’s a slap in the face to the “other tribe,” the hated Christians — see Roth’s Portnoy’s Complaint.)
However, she remains an exotic shiksa despite joining his tribe.
There’s always a reason why an attractive woman couldn’t get a husband before age 30. Maybe marriage wasn’t a priority for her, and she preferred carouseling it. Maybe she spent too much time on her career. Maybe she has mental/emotional issues, addictions, or other personal issues. Maybe she picks the wrong men (which is an indicator of immaturity and low self-knowledge). Or, maybe she’s just a bitch.
It’s usually some combination of all of the above. The last item is more of a symptom of the other issues than a cause.
@ Spike
Huge herds of those women populate the federal workforce in USA. The herds are huge, not necessarily the women themselves, many of which look quite fine; but you have described their particular brand of “awesomeness” to a T.
Spike: When 30 hits, dread settles upon them like a dark cloud. Biology is hitting them hard. Sexual relations aren’t a frivolous game any more. They no longer are attracting male attention as they previously did, and now have to hunt around for what’s left.
I keep hearing this manosphere wisdom about women “hitting the wall” at 30, and feeling dread. I’ve not seen much of that in Los Angeles. Instead of dread, I see delusion.
Many women in their 30s still behave like twentysomethings — or like teenagers. I even see women in their 40s (single mothers too) behaving like teenagers. Lots of carouseling (or acting as if they’re entitled to).
I once encountered an (unknown) actress who was 42. She wore tight jeans, with sparkly letters on the backside. I forgot what it said. LOVE or something equally vapid and silly. She also wore sparkly platform shoes. She looked so ridiculous, I never forgot her. But I suppose she thought her clothes sent out “youthful vibes.”
At least in Los Angeles, there are lots of delusional women in their 30s and 40s who think they can still live like twentysomethings or younger.
Griffith is as you say, among the most genetically gifted women in the country.
Oh come on. She is above the (low) average for her age, but not that great. If anything she reminds us of how catastrophically a woman’s looks plummet with age, when someone like her is considered pretty ‘for her age’.
Griffith is as you say, among the most genetically gifted women in the country.
“Oh come on.”
It wasn’t really reference to her looks, but potential life span. If she is among those genetically gifted and super healthy that might live to 106, at 53 she is already half dead.
What would happen if you said that to her during the interview? “Still looking for Mr. Right? You know Wendy, you’re basically half dead at this point.”
Griffith genetically gifted? Puh-lease. She’s an animated advertisement for makeup, hair color, plastic surgery, and botox. Without it all she’d look exactly like what you’d expect a 53-year-old to look like.
The funny part is, the average 53-year-old woman has a much better shot at getting married than Griffith, because the average 53-year-old is a lot more realistic about her chances.
Red Pill Latecomer January 18, 2018 at 9:58 pm
”I keep hearing this manosphere wisdom about women “hitting the wall” at 30, and feeling dread. I’ve not seen much of that in Los Angeles. Instead of dread, I see delusion.”
I would say there is a lot of that as well, RPL. I often speak anecdotally, and the anecdote here is that I meet a lot of professional women in work who are exactly as I describe. Since I work in the sciences, I see and hear dread since the women who I encounter are at least partly, thinking scientifically, or rather, the scientific training eventually hits against their ”high SMV forever” brainwashing.
Outside of my professional life, I see occasional glimpses of the delusion you describe – women in their 30s and even 40s who still think they are ”girls”, despite obviously being mutton-dressed-as-lamb. Another is the lesbian. This is particularly tragic.
Recent studies conducted in the USA, Britain and Australia have shown that the median number of male sexual partners a self-described lesbian has had number the mid 40s. That is, she has had upwards of 40 male partners. That is far more than the average married woman. The studies concluded that, rather than same-sex attraction in women being biological in nature, it is the natural result of sexual anarchy for varied reasons (rebellion, mental illness etc).
I have encountered gay women who have admitted to several relationships with men (”Let me tell you about men…”). Their stories are similar: unrestrained sex with many partners but unable to either commit to one or being unpleasant so as to drive the partner away.Although rather than be introspective and ask themselves why they are the reason, they willfully double down on their choices and say, “All men are bastards and don’t deserve me…”.
The studies concluded that, rather than same-sex attraction in women being biological in nature, it is the natural result of sexual anarchy for varied reasons (rebellion, mental illness etc).
Same-sex attraction is not biological in nature for both sexes.
I know people think these women will always be single but
the churchians are fighting
actively retraining and rewiring men to serve these women
I have been reading this book
apparently men who never change diapers are sinning, men who do not support their wives gifts and dreams and abandon theirs are sinning
he also commands men to wash their wife’s feet weekly
like what?
is a christian man just now a modern slave?
I always wonder why they never ask this of women
do you really think these churchians won’t train men to marry 55 year old career sluts?
https://www.tvcresources.net/resource-library/sermons/the-complementary-roles-of-men-and-women
Here is another beta male training camp
He asks his wife permission to do anything, meet his friend
he tells men to sacrifice their calling for their wife’s gifts- he reworks his entire life based on what his wife wants to do
his wife goes overseas on mission trips and he tells his men that if their wives want to do the same they should be fine with looking after babies
he even said Martin Luther King was wrong on Patriarchy!!
then he commands the single men to let the single women lead and ask God to help you get over your insecurities?!!!!
if women here this
how can you blame them for delaying marriage/!!!
lol no King
just Martin Luther
fail…
like I cannot believe this
“”Men have broad and large chests and small, narrow hips, and more understanding than women,
who have but small and narrow breasts, and broad hips, to the end they should remain at home, sit
still, keep house, and bear and bring up children.” Martin Luther, ladies and gentlemen. Martin
Luther, not Matt Chandler. Martin Luther, one of the fathers of the Protestant Reformation. Now you
could say terrible statements like that, and that is a terrible statement. “
Luther is my homeboy.
but apparently it is a terrible statement!…
I see no bible in his justification of why it is terrible?
yet millions read his books and almost pseudo worship the guy.
FYI he is training men to be slaves to women, the younger pastors all have wives who work , these men instragram themselves feeding children and looking after the babies while their wife is out working….
my previous church used to do this as well
@JTenglish is one example… his wife went back to work in 3 months
career women will have heaps of men to marry
Just go to Chandlers church
do you really think these churchians won’t train men to marry 55 year old career sluts?
They’ll try, but they will NEVER succeed at getting men to overcome their biological programming. And given the slowly-but-surely growing influence of the RP, more and more men are going to see clowns like the author of that book for the cucked churchian frauds that they are (fewer and fewer men will be attending church anymore anyway, but that’s a whloe ‘nother discussion).
And PLEASE tell me that you didn’t PAY for a copy of that god-awful churchian cuck manifesto…
you sure
I see so many men falling for it
all women are Queens no matter how old
look up @JTEnglish, trained by the southern baptists- the new millennial pastor who’s wife works so he can sit at home and care for the kids to demonstrate how he sacrifices his goals to enable his wife’s career and show true leadership.
or even Chandler, he keeps boasting how he asks permission from his wife
or even at my old church, they used to train single men to basically do everything a wife used to do to show us real servanthood.
people like us are in the minority.
I had a disagreement with my church just recently, they practice church discipline so I asked if they would discipline a house husband with a career wife and I got an emphatic NO
God created both men and women to rule….
no I did not, but I used to….
But I started asking myself where in the bible does it say a man who does not do diapers is sinning ( nothing wrong with doing them but if one chooses not to , it is not sinful)
that lead me to start questioning everything and cross checking with the bible
Or you could point out the man is going out to work to get his daily bread so that his wife can afford to put diapers on the child.
55 will be a stretch…I think even they know a man won’t go for that. Now a 29-35 year old career slut…
no, no , no
stating what is obvious in Asian cultures is extremely offensive in my country
It always amused me, men who cannot expect their wives to change with child’s diapers somehow think this wife will submit to him in larger decisions like moving home etc?!
Chandler even said it one of the sermons, providing is not enough, providing and protecting means nothing, a man is only truly serving if he is doing traditionally female roles and enabling his wife to succeed in the workplace
I had to laugh at that quote…he would be crucified today for pointing out something as simple as biological differences in men and women.
What a maroon.
A man only succeeds if he is the helpmate and the woman is the head…that’s Satanic inverse 101. Another marriage-family destroying ethos.
Much like women becoming their own betas…what’s the point if men are becoming their own helpmates? You can be single and do that.
I’d ask…what motivates their delusion that they can be youthful forever.
Is it dread?
aah but they don’t see men doing those roles as being a helpmeet
that is headship for them
this is why career sluts will have millions of beta males ready to servant lead and play the perfect modern husband
Look at the young husbands in Chandlers church as an example.
war is peace
freedom is slavery
ignorance is strength
https://www.funnyandjokes.com/pleasing-a-women.html
“A new, special kind of store just opened up in a Manhatten shopping center. This store sells husbands, yes that’s right – women can browse men from floors of choices.
Actually, there are 6 floors of men, and with an increase in the floor level bringing an positive attributes… a nifty setup – with a catch. As you open the door to any floor, you may choose a man from that floor but if you go up, you cannot go back down except to exit the building. Interesting, right?
So a young woman goes to the shopping center to find a husband. On the first floor the sign on the door reads: Floor 1 – These men have jobs. The woman reads the sign and says to herself, “Well, that’s better than my last boyfriend, but I wonder what’s further up?” So up she goes.
The second floor sign reads: Floor 2 – These men have jobs and love kids. The woman remarks to herself, “That’s great, but I wonder what’s further up?” And up she goes again.
The third floor sign reads: Floor 3 – These men have jobs, love kids and are extremely good looking. “Hmmm, better” she says. “But I wonder what’s upstairs?”
The fourth floor sign reads: Floor 4 – These men have jobs, love kids, are extremely good looking and help with the housework. “Wow!” exclaims the woman, “very tempting. BUT, there must be more further up!” And again she heads up another flight.
The fifth floor sign reads: Floor 5 – These men have jobs, love kids, are extremely good looking, help with the housework and have a strong romantic streak. “Oh, mercy me! But just think… what must be awaiting me further on?” So up to the sixth floor she goes.
The sixth floor sign reads: Floor 6 – You are visitor 7,548,652 to this floor. There are no men on this floor. This floor only exists as proof that women are impossible to please.”
To my future husband: I know you will be worth the wait!
— Wendy Griffith, Age 53*
The fact that a 53 year old is making this statement is surreally comically absurd. I wonder if she will still be making this statement at 73 or 83.
@Morpheus
Yes it is. Even more surreal is that the quote is from the dedication to her book teaching other women how to find a husband.
Dear Earl:
Oh, I dunno. I’ve seen the typical lonely, old (65+) widower get taken in by a 50-something prostitute, looking for a way out of her cubicle job. If Wendy were more serious about helping her empowered sisters take advantage of the suckers, she’d push the scenario of exploiting old 70-year old sad sacks. They often don’t live long, anyway, and the payout is much better.
It’s not surreal, it’s terribly sad and delusional.
She’s not a Christian, but take a google for “Jody Day”, a Brit lady who runs a site for childless women – she reckons 80% of them never meant to be childless, “it just happened”. Her career/marital path doesn’t seem untypical.
“She got married, aged 26, to Christian, 33, a fashion designer, and initially warned him she might not want children. ‘He said, “Oh, OK.” Amazingly, we didn’t talk about it any more than that,’ she recalls. Jody had had an abortion when she was 20 during a previous relationship, which was ‘emotionally traumatic’. But as the child of an unmarried mother (her mother became pregnant with her aged 18), she had grown up with the idea that having a child on your own can ruin your life. Far better to put your energies into an education and a career. “
Fast forward 18 years, baby rabies at 29, ten years of trying to conceive followed by the marriage breaking up, more relationships, and that abortion starts to look real clever …
“It was February 2009 and, at 44-and-a-half, she had left a bad long-term relationship and moved into a grotty London flat. “I was standing by the window, watching the rain make dusty tracks down the glass, when the traffic in the street below seemed to go silent, as if I’d put it on ‘mute’. In that moment, I became acutely aware of myself, almost as if I were an observer of the scene from outside my body. And then it came to me: it’s over. I’m never going to have a baby.””
… or you can try to rely on mathematical game theory:
https://mindyourdecisions.com/blog/2008/01/08/game-theory-tuesdays-how-can-i-find-true-love/
“Reject the first 37 percent of the people you want to date and then pick the next person better than anyone before. Surprisingly, you’ll end up with your true love 37 percent of the time.”
“To my future husband: I know you will be worth the wait!
— Wendy Griffith, Age 53”
Dear Wendy,
You weren’t. I’ve moved on. You should, too.
-Your (Ex) future husband
To my future husband: I know your trust fund was worth the wait!
It is a strange thing: Customer Service is something at which Americans excel. We, the British are trying to follow America’s example but even wishing you a nice day, when we say it, always sounds like and F*%* you too. We do grumpy, more grumpy and even more grumpy – we love choice. Perhaps it is the endless rain that is the cause of this grumpiness. Why then is it that your women outside of customer-services appear to be Monsters from Hell, the real Wifezilla,
When I look at photos of my Mothers friends (when they were about Wendy Griffith’s age) I can only feel sorry for their long-suffering husbands because they (the women – but the men too I think) look dreadfully middle-aged. That many women now take better care of their appearance is I think something to appreciate. Modern women may be deluded as to their desirability and thus their options but they often seem happier. That at least is my experience; yours may differ.
Splashman,
Griffith genetically gifted? Puh-lease. She’s an animated advertisement for makeup, hair color, plastic surgery, and botox. Without it all she’d look exactly like what you’d expect a 53-year-old to look like.
Thank you. She is thin, but that is it.
Her face, independent of age, has a very unkind, predatory, extractory structure.
To my future husband: I know you will be worth the wait!
— Wendy Griffith, Age 53*
This may be her epitaph on her tombstone.
Same-sex attraction is not biological in nature for both sexes.
You can say that again.
It’s been said that most homosexual adults were sexually abused as kids.
Here is another beta male training camp[link to a Matt Chandler video]
Matt Chandler is a joke. He flails his hands in awkward gesticulations as he preaches his Gospel according to Feminism. Sad.
To my future husband: I know your trust fund was worth the wait!
Now, that is really funny. Thank you for a really good laugh!
To those dinging on Wendy Griffith’s attractiveness or lack thereof, I think you have to look at it more objectively.
Sure, her face has something of a “hard” look. That’s to be expected at age 53. To me she looks more cynical, wizened, “worldly wise”, and kind of weatherbeaten. Also to be expected from a 53 year old woman who has been around the block more than a few times and worked a career as a man has.
But she is objectively top 5% in sexual attractiveness for a woman of her age. She has kept in tiptop physical shape, as you’d expect for a woman in broadcast journalism where your job depends on how easy you are on the eyes on camera. She looks better than a lot of women half her age, at least in the Midwest, where we have more than our share of 27 year old hambeasts. It’s probably different on the coasts, in fact from descriptions from others, I am sure it is. In the Midwest Wendy Griffith is a 10+ for her age. And she’s objectively top 25% in sexual attractiveness for women overall. Someone pointed out, probably Nova, that Wendy Griffith is the type of woman who is accustomed to being among the most attractive women in the room wherever she is. She’s used to getting attention from top men, and lots of attention.
It’s her marriage market value that’s in the cellar. She’s waited far, far too long, obviously. She’s so set in her ways, she will be completely unable to make the deep compromises she’ll have to make to marry at this very, very late date. She’s not a virgin (despite her faith). If she were a virgin, she’d say so and advertise that fact. Second, there is no way a woman who looks like Griffith makes it to her early 50s without giving it up to a very, very attractive man, particularly in today’s culture where even the overwhelming majority of Christian women are having premarital sex. I add in the “not a virgin” thing because supposedly virginity is a selling point for marriage, but for a very attractive woman like Wendy Griffith, the only men who will even be in the running are very attractive men roughly her age, and none of them will be sexually inexperienced nor will they care about whether she’s had sex before.
bdash 77: he also commands men to wash their wife’s feet weekly. like what? is a christian man just now a modern slave?
Perhaps the author has a foot fetish? And this is his way of tricking his wife into giving him sex. She thinks he’s serving her, whereas he’s actually enjoying what she refuses to give him in bed.
A woman like Wendy Griffith should have had no trouble at all finding attractive marriageable Christian men willing to marry her. Most women her age have attractive men lined up out the door and around the block.
So there must be some reason why she didn’t marry. With Christian women it’s usually a combination of the following:
–her standards and expectations for men are way, way too high – she expects attention from extremely attractive men who have a lot of options
–prioritized education and career over marriage and family, and further expected to meet men who understood they would take a back seat to her career
–she doesn’t differentiate herself from nonChristian women because she acts just like them – she dates and has premarital sex, she practices serial monogamy, she puts career over marriage and family, she’s vain about her physical appearance, she focuses on material acquisition, etc.
–confusion over what they want (very physically attractive, ambitious, good looking, high status men who happen to profess Christian faith) with what current American Christian thought tells them publicly they should want (nice, kind, family men, father-types who do whatever she tells them to do)
–unresolved emotional/mental issues, daddy issues
I’m not saying Griffith has all of these or even most of these. I don’t know. But the cause is in there somewhere.
Most women her age have attractive men lined up out the door and around the block.
Should have been
Most women who look like her have attractive men lined up out the door and around the block, and she picks one well before she’s 30.
If you insist on driving a Bentley, then you’d better have the goods to buy a Bentley. If you only have the goods to buy an Accord… sorry… hate break it to ya… but you’re not going to own a Bentley.
And what – exactly – is wrong with that? An Accord is a great car. It’s dependable, reliable, low maintenance, long lasting, efficient, etc. It does what it’s supposed to do with minimum fuss, and does it well, and it’s even fun to drive, especially with the V-6. Most people would be perfectly happy owning and driving one.
Very few people are Bentleys, and very few people have the goods to buy a Bentley. Most people are Accords, or Camries, or F-150s. And most people have to goods to buy an Accord, or a Camry, or an F-150, and they’d be perfectly happy with their choice, if they committed to it.
The problem is that so many women today think they deserve a Bentley and have no clue that they lack the goods to secure one.
Well, hate to break it to ya, toots, but your goods are depreciating. If you wait until your 30s, your goods won’t even secure a Camry. If you wait until your 50s – like the illustrious Ms. Wendy – then; can I interest you in this high-mileage, used Yugo?
@ thedeti says:
January 19, 2018 at 11:57 am
“Sure, her face has something of a ‘hard’ look. That’s to be expected at age 53. To me she looks more cynical, wizened, ‘worldly wise’, and kind of weatherbeaten. Also to be expected from a 53 year old woman who has been around the block more than a few times and worked a career as a man has.”
I’m glad you brought that up, because I was just thinking about that “hard look” that a lot of the older women at work seem to have. In fact, that’s exactly the term that sprang to mind (“hard look”).
Is that normal?
I ask because, although I’m 42, I have little experience working with women. I spent most of my late teens, 20s and 30s in all-male Army units. And most people in units Battalion-sized and below are fairly young.
Now in corporate civilian life, I’ve noticed that the majority of the women in their 30s and older have this permanent “I will bust your balls” look on their faces. Is that the way it is everywhere?
Here’s another thing I’ve noticed. You can tell some of the women in their 40s used to be very attractive. Those women tend to dress like they’re still college girls. Ironically, the women in their 20s dress more conservatively than the formerly pretty women in their 40s.
It’s all kind of crazy.
@bdash77,
“…apparently men who never change diapers are sinning, men who do not support their wives gifts and dreams and abandon theirs are sinning”
Most church leaders have inverted the “woman as helpmeet”. Now, Christian women are supposed to help or start a ministry with their husbands help at home.
Oscar:
yes it is normal for women as they age to develop something of a “hard look”.
Part of it is the normal, natural aging process. Part of it is the fact that unlike most women of her vintage, Wendy Griffith isn’t carrying 30 or so extra pounds to soften the hard lines of her face. Note the angular manjaw and deep set eyes. A lot of women getting into their 40s and 50s don’t have this look because the skin on the face starts sagging, there’s a double chin, or sometimes the beginnings of a turkey wattle, and they’ve never had any facelifts or cosmetic surgical work done. (My guess is Griffith’s probably had some work done, maybe some face tightening. It’s common for professional talking heads to have that done.)
Part of it in my opinion is the stresses of working a career, working the kinds of hours and carrying the kinds of stresses on the mind and body that typical working men carry. Women aren’t built to work like men – the hours, the stress and strains, etc.
And part of it in my opinion is repeated disappointment with men (and some sexual experience). She doesn’t have the hollow-eyed, vacant look of the “thousand cock stare”. She does, though, have the toughened, hardened exterior that comes with having endured a lot of disappointment and frustration in trying and failing to secure a man’s commitment.
She kind of looks something like Jacqueline Halbig von Schleppenbach, a woman who was a subject of some posts a few years back in the manosphere. Halbig was and still is a mover and shaker in the pro life movement, a devout observant Catholic, and a political consultant in DC. She was 44 when she married 49-year old Greg Schleppenbach, a lay employee of a Catholic diocese in Nebraska. It is the first marriage for both of them. They married in 2013 or 2014, I believe, and from what I can tell they are still married. She would be 48 now, her husband would be 53.
Here’s an undated photo of Ms. Halbig:
She has that same wizened, cynical, toughened exterior with the “don’t give me that bullshit” facial expression you see on women who work high octane, time consuming careers. It’s not “thousand cock stare”. It’s go go career, this-aint-my-first-rodeo, “anything you can do I can do better”.
It’s not “thousand cock stare”. It’s go go career, this-aint-my-first-rodeo, “anything you can do I can do better”.
Point of clarification. Is “hard look” equivalent to “resting bitch face”?
Hard look I’ve seen plenty but resting bitch face is a term from the sphere I have not yet quite grasped.
Compare current Wendy Griffith:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CEWzYd5WoAAZg0l.jpg:large
To a still shot of her from June 2009, 8 1/2 years ago, when she was about 45:
This was one of the earliest shots I could find of her. Note that even 45 year old Wendy looks “softer” than 52 or 53-year old Wendy.
Wrong shot. Here’s Wendy from June 2009:
LP:
Even young girls can have resting bitch face. My daughter is 18 and sometimes has resting bitch face.
Here’s 17 year old gymnast McKayla Maroney turning on some resting bitch face:
LP:
Hard look is what very physically attractive women develop as they age, brought on by all the things I mentioned: aging, career, life disappointments.
Came across this new book for women: Cowgirl Power: How to Kick Ass in Business and Life: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1478948213
Here’s a blurb from Billie Jean King:
“Cowgirls are the ones who don’t back down from anything or anyone. The ones who work harder and keep playing until they get it right. Gay Gaddis calls this ‘Cowgirl Power.’ Her stories give women a clear path to find their own personal power.”
Resting bitch face, though, is not to be confused with “Bitch, please” face:
“Cowgirls are the ones who don’t back down from anything or anyone. The ones who work harder and keep playing until they get it right. Gay Gaddis calls this ‘Cowgirl Power.’ Her stories give women a clear path to find their own personal power.”
And then fall apart at the first sign of ‘adulting’.
I’ve seen women who act like this…tough one day, crying the next.
Not only is Wendy Griffith getting work done, but the reality is that childbirth and nursing change your body. Motherhood is taxing as well.
She has not been through either of those and the few older women we’ve who look almost as good, have also been lifelong single/no kids. You can be fit after kids, but some things are just not ever going to be the same without some cosmetic tinkering.
This choice is also quite real:
https://fashionmagazine.com/beauty/jane-fonda/
With my melanin bestowed bonus, lines aren’t an issue yet. I have decided (husband says it’s my choice), that if my chin starts to sag is a day before age 60, we’re getting it fixed. Perhaps the vanity will have worn off by then but it’s doubtful.
Genderless Fashion is now trending in Japan: https://medium.com/@TokyoFashion/genderless-kei-japan-s-hot-new-fashion-trend-9e25a2c559c6
I add in the “not a virgin” thing because supposedly virginity is a selling point for marriage, but for a very attractive woman like Wendy Griffith, the only men who will even be in the running are very attractive men roughly her age, and none of them will be sexually inexperienced nor will they care about whether she’s had sex before.
Deti —
Yes, but it’s actually even worse for her, because very attractive men who are roughly her age can and will attract the hot women who are 10 years younger than Wendy. Realistically she’s looking at less attractive men her own age(ish) or more attractive men around 60. Likely she doesn’t want either — hence, single she is.
Elspeth:
That’s a good point: Griffith has never had any kids. Most of the women I work with have kids, and have been primary caregivers in addition to working at least part time.
He asks his wife permission to do anything, meet his friend
he tells men to sacrifice their calling for their wife’s gifts- he reworks his entire life based on what his wife wants to do
his wife goes overseas on mission trips and he tells his men that if their wives want to do the same they should be fine with looking after babies
It won’t take too many steps to go from this to cuckoldry. It won’t be openly encouraged, and there will be token condemnation of it. But at that same time these pastors will exhort men to forgive wives who stray from their husbands, even if they do so multiple times. Forgiving straying wives will be regarded as more “christlike” or something.
@ Oscar:
An Accord is a great car. It’s dependable, reliable, low maintenance, long lasting, efficient, etc. It does what it’s supposed to do with minimum fuss, and does it well, and it’s even fun to drive, especially with the V-6. Most people would be perfectly happy owning and driving one.
See, that’s the problem. She doesn’t want an Accord. She wants a Bentley. Or a Ferrari. Because, you see, she doesn’t want dependable, reliable or long lasting. She can do that herself because Daddy Government gets her a late model gently used Corolla every 5 years. She wants exciting, lush, luxury, leather, heated seats, the V-8, and the mag wheels. If she wrecks it, another one’s always available at the New Guy Dealership. And she wants to lease it, not buy it.
Until she can’t afford them anymore, and then she wants the Camry, Accord or F-150. But then she gets one, and she hates it. She immediately starts beating it up and complaining about it. She won’t maintain the fluids, and doesn’t even check their levels much less change them out. And then wonders why it breaks down.
thedeti
Ah, so. Arigato.
It seems simple but can be confusing. The women at church have formed two distinct groups. One is hard look all the way and in the other everyone seems to be smiling all the time, quite pleasant. But both have all ages and attractiveness levels represented. The young ones haven’t had time to collect the mileage for true hard look I suppose, but if they are from that group they do a good impersonation.
I should note that none of them may be true “hard look” (no true Scotsman!) since you can usually soften them up by just paying a little attention to them.
How much of this has to do with the low status of the average, non-bedazzling man in that authoress’ society? She chooses non-marriage for her life because getting married to what she perceives is the wrong man is, for her, significantly worse than being single. How much does it exemplify the weakness of her society which apparently is unable to opine on the perfidity of unmarried persons?
Saying out-loud “there are too many unmarried persons at this place of business, we must hire more family men or else risk instability” is probably forbidden at the organisations round about that authoress. The loathsome H.R. departments, themselves direct products of the “anti-discrimination” lawsuits from the interventionist State, influence this lady’s stunted thinking. Garbage in, garbage out.
A.J.P.
@Spike
This made me think of Griffith’s bio on her twitter page:
@Nova:
Yes, but it’s actually even worse for her, because very attractive men who are roughly her age can and will attract the hot women who are 10 years younger than Wendy. Realistically she’s looking at less attractive men her own age(ish) or more attractive men around 60. Likely she doesn’t want either — hence, single she is.
The men interested in her are men like Kevin Sorbo
Who will be attractive to younger women too. Or men like Greg Schleppenbach, the man who married wizened, no-nonsense Jacqueline Halbig:
who, let’s face it, is no Matthew McConnaughey, or even Kevin Sorbo.
The men interested in her are men like Kevin Sorbo
They look like brother and sister in that photo. Striking resemblance, as they say.
@Red Pill Latecomer, that’s the case in LA and for delusional women. My observation of women I know has been as they approach 30, by hell or high water they will be married or damned. All their friends are married and they don’t want to be the only single one. They will go on a furious search and land the “good enough” one, hoping to repair any flaws the dude might have. Only delusional ones like Griffith, or the masses of wanna-be actresses ignore their ticking clocks. It is hard to suppress that million year old instinct women have, knowing their eggs are expiring. But some manage.
@Morpheus,
Excellent, thanks for posting that!
(Though it’s unfortunate that it’s classified as a joke. Seems like an accurate metaphor to me.)
I don’t think the main driver for women snatching up the best available leftovers when they reach the wall is this indignation. I think more so it’s the hind brain, instinct. Maybe 40% is instinct which reinforces the solipsistic indignation at 25%. Together they transform those pretty nails into sharp claws to seize their man away from those other predatory bitches. Instead of draining the prey’s blood, they drain his balls, and sucker him into thinking a blissful marriage life awaits.
The Wall, as if we needed another lesson:
Cybill Shepherd, circa age 22
age 35, wall still staved off but in view:
Just past The Wall, probably early 40s:
Collision with The wall complete, probably late 50s:
that’s the case in LA and for delusional women. My observation of women I know has been as they approach 30, by hell or high water they will be married or damned.
Yeah this is very region and city specific. It’s very common for women to unmarried at 35 in DC, NY, Miami, Boston, etc. It’s common for women to be married at that age, too, but there isn’t a stampede at 29. That was the case here (in the DC region) about 20 or so years ago now, but not today, the age has crept up. Panic mode sets in now in the later 30s, after 35.
Dalrock – I’ve been a reader of your blog for awhile now – maybe a year or so. Thanks for it.
Question: I’ve yet to see a solid (Biblical) articulation of what a man is supposed to be and what his calling is. I would imagine it to be along the lines of “Raise and nurture children; build a Godly household; influence society for the Kingdom.” and – oh yes, you’ll need help with that, so find a wife who is committed to these same values and devotes herself to supporting you in God’s call on your life. First, though, I would like to see a solid vision of a man’s calling in this world, in and of itself. Once that is solidly clear in everyone’s mind, then proceed, maybe much later, to defining womanhood from the perspective of the man’s calling, since that is the Biblical pattern.
feel free to move this comment wherever you like, and/or respond as you see fit. Maybe there are some old sermons out there somewhere that define this. It would seem to me that the mistake Lewis points out, and that you have referred to, which I can’t remember right now but seems related, as I remember it, to the triumph of romantic notions of love in the west, could not have happened unless the primary calling and understandings of manhood had already been obliterated, perhaps in part by the Roman Catholic Church’s fascination with Mary, which would perhaps have influenced western culture for a thousand years. That is, by the time western ideals of romantic love had triumphed, “real manhood” was either an ignorant stinking farmer, a rich toady of a nobleman, or a knight on a horse. Note how all of these versions of manhood are partially true and yet horribly distorted, and completely empty of the initial calling of God to “till the earth and subdue it.” That is, to live a life of nurturing the world at large and making it a better place.
In sum, what I would be curious to explore would be the recovery of the initial calling and role of men – male men -real men – in the world.
As an aside, part of the certainty I have that men are to nurture and raise families is the potency of “taking the kids.” If men truly were self-oriented pleasure seekers, why would the wife taking the kids be such a potent weapon?
With that I’ll close. Thanks again for hosting this blog and making a space where questions like this can be raised.
Really a woman finding a husband is a variant of the secretary problem in decision theory. You’d want to run some numbers based on different assumptions about how long it takes to evaluate a suitor, but I’m guessing the optimal strategy is something along the lines of “evaluate the first two or three serious suitors and marry the next one that’s better than those two or three”. More than that and the odds are going to fall off sharply. Doubly so if the quality of suitors declines with your own age.
While of course while dating I was pretty blue-pilled and would never have thought of it in this way, I basically ended up doing that – married the third person I dated, and she was better than the previous two. Two kids and almost a decade later, I do have to say it worked out pretty well. (Of course the actual numbers are likely a little different for a man, conceptually it’s still similar.)
I remember someone asking in a small group that we pray for her 40 year old daughter to have a child. Lots of illogical thought going on.
I would also note that some women in long term marriages don’t know how to work through the stresses that naturally arise.
why does God allow these feminist christians to prosper?
There are people who read and study the bible everyday, even have PHDS yet they are fully feminist both the men and women
and quite successful
you don’t see or hear about successful traditional men…
Matt:
Really a woman finding a husband is a variant of the secretary problem in decision theory. You’d want to run some numbers based on different assumptions about how long it takes to evaluate a suitor, but I’m guessing the optimal strategy is something along the lines of “evaluate the first two or three serious suitors and marry the next one that’s better than those two or three”. More than that and the odds are going to fall off sharply. Doubly so if the quality of suitors declines with your own age.
That’s actually not a bad theory. But a woman also has to factor in time as a variable. Time is always working against a woman during this process. Figure a month or three to evaluate one suitor. Maybe even up to a year to evaluate two or three suitors. By then, a year is gone, with her having eliminated the first two serious ones. Now she has to find the “next one that’s better than the first two or three” in an indeterminate time frame. It could take a month, or it could take years, to find “the next one that’s better”. That’s a real problem for women in this search.
To my future husband: I know you will be worth the wait!
— Wendy Griffith, Age 53*
Hahaha. What kind of a pathetically thirsty dumb ass would legally marry a menopausal woman?
Marriage exists to provide a stable arrangement for raising children. She can’t have any. Ever. What then would be the point of potentially subjecting yourself to insane divorce laws?
Sex/Companionship? You can get it without marriage. She already has.
Money from her? She is certainly not going to marry any man who is less successful than she is. If she does, you can bet your ass she will have a team of lawyers protecting her assets.
Love? You certainly don’t need to be married to love someone or commit to them.
So deluded and sad and graceless.
perhaps in part by the Roman Catholic Church’s fascination with Mary, which would perhaps have influenced western culture for a thousand years.
Unlikely the reason. Orthodoxy also reveres Mary but Eastern Orthodox countries didn’t have the same development of overly romanticized versions of sex relations (at least until mostly secular high society types imported them in due to social taste … something that didn’t really peter down to the masses at all). More likely culprit is the Western “courtly love tradition”, which really had nothing to do with Mary, and everything to do with the fantasy of unconsummated adulterous love between hunky knights and hot highborn women (who were married to other highborn men).
It is a strange thing: Customer Service is something at which Americans excel.
This tells me that you haven’t visited this end of the Pond in awhile. The prevailing attitude of most American businesses these days toward customers is “Fuck you! Leave your money in the cash register and GO AWAY!!! What, you want an actual PRODUCT OR SERVICE in exhange for your money??!! GTFOOH!”
@Hawk
according to this dude
men want to sit at home and care for the kids and help grow their wife’s careers
http://www.communicatejesus.com/5-challenges-christian-men/
if Godly men think that way
it is not such a giant leap to get men to
marry 60 plus women with no looks and perpetually serve them
@Deti
>there is no way a woman who looks like Griffith makes it to her early 50s without giving it up to a very, very attractive man, particularly in today’s culture where even the overwhelming majority of Christian women are having premarital sex.
>the only men who will even be in the running are very attractive men roughly her age, and none of them will be sexually inexperienced nor will they care about whether she’s had sex before.
While I think you know you’re being hyperbolic, it is worth pointing out that neither of these statements is 100% true. I personally know exceptions to both statements.
@novaseeker – thanks for your comment. I’m curious as to how the “Western Courtly Love Tradition” could rise to such power – and my thesis is that it could do so only because the original calling and understanding of what God had called men to do was already gone. The hunky knight is a sad parody of what God called real manhood to be. Where did we lose track of what God’s calling on men was and how do we recover it?
@Mike
Christian men are no interested in Gods calling for them
the vast majority of them are happy to castrate themselves as that is what they have been taught
@bdash – you may be right – I wonder if in part that is because Christian men have no idea what God’s calling for them is – this blog makes it pretty clear that the modern evangelical church has no idea what God’s calling for men is – so I would still like to see a solid exposition of what God calls men to be.
@Mike most Christian churches think they know what God’s calling for men is
to perpetually sacrificially serve and respond to whatever whims and wishes of the wife.
now that most women are interested in a career ( submitting to another instead of her husband)
Churches are training men to sacrificially serve by looking after the house and babies
that is all men are
responders to women
if tomorrow Women decided that they want men to pee sitting down because standing up is misogynistic
Christian men will immediately respond by telling men to sacrificially lead by peeing sitting down
@bdash 77
I agree with your statements – but still am hoping for a recovery of what God created when He created manhood. Does anyone know what that might look like?
@ Dalrock has covered that extensively
Men are called to sacrificially lead- yes but not in the twisted feminist form
Doug is also good on this- not perfect but
https://dougwils.com/books-and-culture/s7-engaging-the-culture/feminism-in-denial.html
he disagrees with the Chandler/Keller feminist view of marriage
RE: Cybill Shepherd, watch, if you haven’t already, The Last Picture Show.
I hope D will correct me if I’m wrong here, but I think one of the biggest problems in this is that women are hung up on this big future decision to make. Fact is, there isn’t really this big monumental decision moment.
Don’t get me wrong, who one marries is clearly a huge choice in life, but marrying is never a single choice. Rather, it is a series of small choices that leads to marriage. Every date, every hookup, every rejection, every condescending comment about the quality of men. It usually takes at least 2 years from the time they meet, through courtship, getting to know each other, engagement, and ultimately marriage. All of these take time.
Accepting a marriage proposal is a huge moment, but it is less a single big choice, and more many choices made along the way.
By the time women say I never found “TheRightMan(TM)” or “my soul mate”, or lament that there are no good men left… it’s not that they never made the big choice to marry, it is that they made seemingly smaller choices all along that lead them away from marriage.
I don’t know the age of Cybil Shepherd but I well remember her in The Lady Vanishes – and what a great movie that was, far better then the original if I may say so – and that was forty years ago now and she was hardly a teenager in that.
I have just had the daftest conversation: where my acquaintances berate me for asserting that men tend to be attracted to younger women – ‘ look any one can fall for any one else provided they are soulmates’ and other crap like that is what I am told. When I ask whether they are the same age as their respective current partners the answer is that they are both younger pretty much making my point. ‘Look Opus’ they say ‘in your dreams are you going to pull a twenty-five year old’ to which I reply that I agree as that is much too old.
” these men instragram themselves feeding children and looking after the babies while their wife is out working….”
There’s going to be a whole lot of interesting attachment disordered psychopathology in “intact”-family UMC Zyklons.
Mommy abandoned me for her 401k.
(Of course, the wealthy have always had the option of foisting their kids off on wet nurses, nannies and boarding schools. But fulltime soydads are, I think, a nu phenomenmom.)
Not wanting a career doesn’t mean a woman wants to serve her husband.
Some of us still find sex outside marriage as prohibited by our Lord, so that is why it remains a pull. Those who don’t follow Christ may not, but those who do have no other valid outlet for sexuality. And having someone around that cares about you is nice. I may not have really had that, but I liked it when I thought I did even though it turned out I was wrong. I am making myself by cautious, but I know exactly why some could get pulled back into marriage in spite of the horrible environment today.
Watch judging those who you have no clue about.
Mike
so I would still like to see a solid exposition of what God calls men to be.
1 Corinthians 11:7-9 7 A man, in fact, should not cover his head, because he is God’s image and glory, but woman is man’s glory. 8 For man did not come from woman, but woman came from man. 9 And man was not created for woman, but woman for man.
God calls men to be the Glory of God and he calls women to be the Glory of man.
@BillyS
Some of us still find sex outside marriage as prohibited by our Lord, so that is why it remains a pull.
I might suggest seeing marriage as Covenant between God, yourself, and the woman. “Legally married” means that the State (Rome) authorizes it. The State is not needed any more than Jesus needed the authorization of Pilate.
It may seem out of the box,but we don’t need the state to make the marriage official. They don’t count and its all about money to the state. FInd a woman, take her as your wife, leave the state out of it.
Just my two cents. Praying for you.
@Mike This series on youtube traces the “romance” culture in England starting in the 17th century. Interesting shifts along the way. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnF6Wej3YO8
“fulltime soydads”
I’m gonna steal the heck out of that one! 😅😅😂😂😂
@freeiker
yup unless you practice full time or part time soy dad duties , you are NOT a man
so MAN UP
also single men- encourage the single women to lead.
This is what Chandler, Keller teach.
Sorry but why are their churches so big?!!!
You really need to stop believing in the myth of the woman who really cares. She doesn’t exist. Your ex-wife proved this to you but yet you remain infantile about it.
Get over the hurdle and live your life.
This whole Wendy thing is so stupid.. she’s over the wall, another wasted opportunity of a unfulfilled life that was never lived. Money isn’t everything.
Whatever man she might find, he’ll be nothing like the man she could have lived her life with had she married at 24 or earlier. To me, she just wanted an excuse so that she could ride the train and enjoy a feminist life whilst being able to milk the money out of the feminist created pool of single, older women who wasted their lives on careers.
She doesn’t want to get married. That much should be apparent to anyone here with a brain.
fh,
I am SURE Wendy wants to get married. I can not even begin to over-emphasize the importance women judge/rate themselves (and each other) on being a WIFE. Go to any book store fh, pick a store at random, and you will find shelves and shelves of self-help books written for women on how to “catch a man” because those books sell. There will not be even one book written for a man on what he must do to “catch a woman.” The desire for a woman to wife herself-up is unavoidable. The problem (as you said) is her age. She missed her window and she is trying to bullshit herself into thinking that the MAN is right around the corner and he will be so lucky to have her. We know otherwise here.
I genuinely believe that women (particularly the intellectual, feminist ones) would do themselves a great service if they took the 30 minutes at age 18 to sit down and read this article.
http://www.newsweek.com/2013/05/29/many-cases-getting-married-young-237436.html
If you can get past the “intellectual hypergamy” that Susan Patton speaks about at the beginning, its a good read. Megan McArdle knocks it out of the park mostly because my favorite female writer deeply regrets (herself) that she didn’t marry younger. Now, she can’t have children. She is too old, missed her window. Yes she is a wife, but will never be a mother. You think that doesn’t bother her every day? I’m sure it does. So this article was more akin to someone giving younger, more intellectual and feminist a “warning” to NOT do what she did. You might like it.
@Billy: Some of us still find sex outside marriage as prohibited by our Lord, so that is why it remains a pull. Those who don’t follow Christ may not, but those who do have no other valid outlet for sexuality. And having someone around that cares about you is nice. I may not have really had that, but I liked it when I thought I did even though it turned out I was wrong. I am making myself by cautious, but I know exactly why some could get pulled back into marriage in spite of the horrible environment today.
The idea that Our Lord prohibited sex without the sanction of the state is unsupportable nonsense. Even worse, elevating the dictates of the state above those of God is idolatry/blasphemy. Following the dictates of the state is not the same thing as following Christ. Obviously, in many, many instances, it is the exact opposite.
Watch out for that.
Although many other blessings naturally flow from it, biblical marriage was created primarily for the welfare of children, and sex within marriage was created primarily for procreation. Accordingly, it is simply unnatural for a menopausal woman to make marriage her primary concern. Just as it is unnatural for a man to make non-procreative sex his primary reason for getting married.
It’s easy to see when men and women twist God’s plan to fit their own desires. Watch out for that.
‘The idea that Our Lord prohibited sex without the sanction of the state is unsupportable nonsense.’
I dont remember Billy stating anything about the state.
@hawk&Rock
sex within marriage was created primarily for procreation. Accordingly, it is simply unnatural for a menopausal woman to make marriage her primary concern. Just as it is unnatural for a man to make non-procreative sex his primary reason for getting married.
1 Corinthians 7:8-9
To the unmarried and the widows I say that it is good for them to remain single, as I am. 9 But if they cannot exercise self-control, they should marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with passion.
People should get married if they cannot control their base urges.
‘The idea that Our Lord prohibited sex without the sanction of the state is unsupportable nonsense.’
I dont remember Billy stating anything about the state.”
Billy didn’t. I brought up the state. even still, the above statement (while 100% true) doesn’t fit that either.
The Lord prohibited sex without the sanction of a covenant with him. The State licenses, “legitimatizes”, and taxes the state of “Marriage” so they can turn it into a financial contract. Just because most people treat the state as God doesn’t mean that its real. Think about it, most “Christians” use the law of the USA as their most used moral compass. Some of that is a conflagration of the bibles charge to submit to your civil authorities as all governments were created by God. Of course its narrowly applied to the individual.
Want to test this? Ask a married friend to visit your church and introduce them as “Married in Gods eyes” but without a “certificate’ from the Government”. You could even go so far as to have your friend write a “certificate of marriage” It wont matter. Judgment will commence forthwith
“I don’t remember Billy stating anything about the state.”
Nor do I see it. Hawk himself refers to “biblical marriage”, so it seems that Hawk has his own definitions where “marriage” and “biblical marriage” are different. If he wants to make a distinction I suggest he use “state marriage”.
bdash,
I would never have supposed you to be a Kiwi.
As I lived in New Zealand for ten years, I have a great disdain for almost all churches there. In this instance, you don’t even bother to point out that those same churchians praising the behavior of NZ’s Prime Minister’s “partner” are ignoring the fact that they aren’t married. I suspect you didn’t mention that fact because you are accustomed to it by the culture surrounding you.
If they were really interested in getting married, they would do so younger, be submissive and choose a decent, hard working gent at the beginning of his journey. We all know this is not what is happening, we all know women choose to believe they lie that they can have it all and then some. That is what Wendy is tapping into, she just does it from a Churchian perspective, adds a bit of shine ’tis all.
The schtick is the same. Women having a whale of a time when they are young and wanted then falling back of the cliche of men not wanting to commit to them when they are older, these men that are just not worth it for Wendy…
That’s the whole joke.
Just as a person reaching the age of 50 realises there are less days ahead than there are behind, Wendy and women her age know that there are less worthy men ahead than the ones they had the chances with when they were younger – denial is a beautiful thing.
Given the posts on Cybil Sheppard I feel inspired to rank by genetic heritage how well women age, worst to best:
Hispanic: Super gorgeous on average when young, get totally wrecked by having a child and gaining weight and most are terrible looking by mid 30s. But they have high marriage rates and they can enjoy the husband goggles. However, even thin Hispanics do not age very well – probably about the same as whites.
White: Confounded by weight gain, but even thin white women age pretty badly.
Blacks: Bimodal. Some age unbelievably well and stay percentage wise at the top of their age into their 50-70s. At the low end, many of them age worse than Hispanics particularly if they gain weight.
Asians: Asian women apparently don’t age until about 50-60 then age rapidly but still manage to look decent for their age. I don’t know how they do it but frankly its amazing how many Asian women I have seen in their 50s and 60s that look great for their age. Asians that gain weight unfortunately look terrible at any age. Asian men also seem to age pretty well.
Of course with caveats about how much effort people put into exercise and health which can benefit them.
@Mike,
Dalrock has written several good posts on the rise of romantic tales encouraging adultery:
https://dalrock.wordpress.com/2017/03/15/fighting-for-his-ladys-honor/
Hose_B,
While I agree the State has no business controlling marriage, trying to have a marriage “outside the state” is fruitless today. Common Law marriage can be shoved on you in most places and nothing will keep such an arrangement from being turned seriously against you either, with Duluth and other things ruling the land.
I don’t find State marriage to be evil enough to completely oppose it, so I will likely just remain single. I just post to note why the pull is there. We live in very rough times and walking through them is quite challenging and difficult for everyone, unfortunately.
@Earlthomas et al.: “I dont remember Billy stating anything about the state.”
The ability to follow an argument has really deteriorated in the West.
Billy was responding to my initial post in which I specifically questioned why any dumbass would “legally marry a menopausal woman” and “potentially subject themselves to the insane divorce laws.”
Billy responded by saying that as a follower of Christ he was prohibited from sex unless he was married, and lectured me not to judge others. Now, maybe he was talking about being drawn to biblical as opposed to state sanctioned marriage but he certainly never made the distinction, and it would be improper to assume such a thing absent any evidence to support it. In fact, it makes the most sense to assume that he was talking about the kind of marriage that I was talking about — the kind attached to “insane divorce laws.”
That’s why I responded by drawing the distinction between state sanctioned and biblical marriage.
I hope that it’s clear now.
the more I look up Chandler and churchianity the more feminism I see everywhere
Acts 29 got Gloria Furman to preach to their Pastors at their conference
all the churchian feminists recently started supporting
this lady
https://www.instagram.com/carocobbmusic/
she does not even use her husbands surname….
if Christianity and feminism just the same thing now?
i.e part of being a christian is being a feminist?
Do you see why reading comprehension is down? It’s because you are implying something that was never actually said at first.
No…you are either a Christian or a feminist. Most of what is called ‘churchian’ is former Christian church that has been overrun by feminism.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/ann-hastings-794a263/
this lady is one of their womens teachers, very proud of having never stayed at home while her kids were born….
this is what they are teaching women
I wonder how much her husband has been held back by her…
do men want career women who submit to other men?
do men want to sit at home and care for their kids to support their wife’s career?
why is this now a requirement of a christian?
@earl
does that mean most christians are not really christian?
all these people have PHD’s in theology etc
how are they so blinded?
FH,
I am sorry you haven’t seen them, but I have seen a few in my life, including my own grandmother. The commitment can be there, though it is much more rare than I had thought until my divorce. I have no idea how to find it ahead of time either, but that does not mean it was not there.
My grandmother, a Lutheran her whole life, going to the Latin Mass a long ways off for years after my grandfather died showed a deeper tie than you will likely ever see. I could explain a lot more, but I learned a lot from her experience, including that she was really a pain in the rear at times to my grandfather when I thought it was just endearing.
No easy road even in a good society, but we are too prosperous now as a society that we can play around with things that will ultimately destroy that very prosperity.
http://www.acts29.com/about/
in one of his sermons Chandler even said that they need to make it easier for wives to leave their homes and work ( especially for his ministry)
this is why he gets men to be guilt ed into halting their career/work for their wives and gives wives jobs
Ann Hastings works at Acts 29
I do not see the easy division between a marriage with a State marriage certificate and one without. I do not see that a woman without one would inherently remain with a man otherwise as well. Even just stealing a lot of his stuff could be hard to prevent, even if it might have consequences. I have no desire to be a security guard like that in my own house.
I have said it before, but I will repeat it, no easy solution exists. Anyone claiming any does is ignorant at best. Perhaps I will help contribute to what eventually turns this around, though most likely not. We are in a much worse time than most realize, even those who post here.
We have sown the wind and will reap the whirlwind, even if it seems like that has been completely avoided for much longer than appears rational.
‘all these people have PHD’s in theology etc
how are they so blinded?’
My guess is they are following the what the world says and not Christ.
I haven’t taken theology classes so I don’t know if their professors are teaching them as badly as a gender studies or social/political science professor.
hmmm
its kinda hard to dismiss them as unbelievers
http://theologyforwomen.org/2017/11/withering-wives-2.html
here is another one
blaming husbands for not obeying their wives command to clean the kitchen and put away the laundry…
like wtf?
where do they get these ideas?
Chandler retweeted it
Sorry but why are their churches so big?!!!
Take a close look, and you’ll see that most of their congregations are female. That explains the pedestalization ad the blasphemous corruption of the Scripture to the female POV.
As I lived in New Zealand for ten years, I have a great disdain for almost all churches there.
To be completely fair and honest, MOST “churches” in the Western world are little more than tepid “Jesus Fan Clubs” full of worldly people in thrall to the culture who have no real intention of following Jesus or adhering to a Christian lifestyle. They are mostly statist, world-worshiping apostates and pretenders who are seeking to paint a religious veneer on their worldly lifestyles. They are not about to rock the boat or put themselves in the position of potentially being ostracized (or, worse, attracting the negative attention of the secular political powers that be) by living the lifestyles of true Christians.
General rule of thumb in the West: if it has its own property, has a formal name, has a paid full-time professional “pastor” at its head, is attended in the main be people indistinguishable from the non-believers one associates with at school or the office during the week and whose behavior is indistinguishable from that of pagans, and does nothing other than meet once or twice a week to sing popular songs indistinguishable from their secular counterparts and listen to a canned lecture from the leader, then it is a “churchian franchise” (a.k.a. a “Jesus Fan Club”) rather than a New Testament Christian church. Needless to say, the West has a plethora of churchian franchises, but very, very few New Testament churches.
@freeiker
except Acts 29, etc have men in it
Chandler has heaps of men following him
all these churches preach the Gospel and care about saving souls.
Yet when it comes to gender- go full feminist
but prevent women from becoming elders….
Churches that preach the gospel but traditional roles are small and declining
“all these people have PHD’s in theology etc
how are they so blinded?”
My explanation, because academia’s strongest appeal is offering a safe, sheltered, predictable existence. That’s a problem for theology because Christ promised that anybody who followed Him would suffer for Him.
Jeff Strand says :
An aside: Elizabeth Banks (the “celebrity” in the YouTube vid) is disgusting.
As usual, Jeff Strand is morally confused. He has no moral compass whatsoever.
Elizabeth Banks married a man while she was still under 30, and has never divorced him. That is extremely rare for an actress. Contrast that with someone like Scarlett Johansson, who is divorced twice by age 32.
Yet, Elizabeth Banks is ‘disgusting’ for being a rare actress who did not marry unusually late, and did not divorce her husband. All because she married a Joooooooooooooooooo who might have aided her career. That is somehow worse than divorce and separating children from their father.
Remember that it takes a considerably higher level of intellectual enlightenment to see that misandry is the greatest evil of our age. Crude racism/tribalism is the currency of those who haven’t evolved since 10,000 BC, so it becomes the default ideology of the intellectually weak. Plus, any ethno-centric ideology has 99% overlap with feminism and hence is a huge part of the problem, for obvious reasons.
Hawk&Rock,
Hahaha. What kind of a pathetically thirsty dumb ass would legally marry a menopausal woman?
Jonah Goldberg married a woman 6 years older than him, even though he was somewhat famous already.
Jim Gay-ratty married a single mother, who may be older than him.
@ GunnerQ
haha yes suffer
these people think they are suffering for Christ by not being a a Godly wife
https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/will-you-still-work-when-the-baby-is-born/
she does not want to support her husband so instead of following the bible just claims everyone must work so she should work.
is this what Christian marriages are like?
If a husband is a minister liker hers his he has to negotiate with her career and vocational goals, he cannot assume a supportive wife?
Why are men so weak?
here is another woman boasting about how she does not serve her husband as she should
https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/having-it-all-at-work-and-at-home/
but its all fine because he reconciles with her….
they actually think what they are doing is really hard and it represents the Gospel
She mad her husband look after the kids when they were young and now they just shifted for her career….
https://www.risenmotherhood.com/transcriptions/ep-83-nikki-daniels-finding-freedom-in-christ-as-a-working-mom-transcript
she thinks her “hard” work is suffering
Yet, Elizabeth Banks is ‘disgusting’ for being a rare actress who did not marry unusually late, and did not divorce her husband. All because she married a Joooooooooooooooooo who might have aided her career. That is somehow worse than divorce and separating children from their father.
All true. However, if she were a Christian prior to conversion to Judaism, that would be apostasy and would in fact be about the worst thing a Christian can do. I think that’s the main problem mentioned by the person you quote.
However, I view the possibility of her having been an actual follower of Christ as unlikely. In that case, we should wish her family a happy marriage and pray that they may all come to follow Jesus in time.
Why are men so weak?
Fearing (wo)man rather than God is the ultimate sign of weak manhood. It’s also a sign of pagan apostasy: man worships that which he fears, and what Western men today fear most of all is women (and the armed State that enables women in their dyscivilizational behavior).
@ Dalrock
You got a shout over here:
You Should Be Reading Dalrock
http://theothermccain.com/2018/01/19/you-should-be-reading-dalrock/
You Should Be Reading Dalrock
http://theothermccain.com/2018/01/19/you-should-be-reading-dalrock/
That is GOOD. RS McCain might be drifting from purple pill to red.
I have been critical of RS McCain in the past for being a Tradcon who, while bashing the frankly easy targets that the bluehaired shoggoths are, nonetheless assumes that Republican women are against feminism and the current divorce and custody laws are not particularly unfair, but he seems to be evolving in the right direction.
@freeiker
are those men weak or silenced
https://rickthomas.net/help-domineering-husband-doormat-wife/
here they ask the whole church to rally against a man who expects submission from his wife.
apparently expecting submission is a sin
if expecting submission is a sin
why is expecting love from a husband not a sin?
@freeiker
are those men weak or silenced
Both, obviously.
“Churches” like these need to be called out publicly for being the Servants of Satan that they obviously are.
Anon: Yet, Elizabeth Banks is ‘disgusting’ for being a rare actress who did not marry unusually late, and did not divorce her husband. All because she married a Joooooooooooooooooo who might have aided her career.
Jeff Strand didn’t say that Banks was disgusting because she married a Jew, but because she converted to Judaism for his sake. She traded Christ for worldly success.
Banks should have refused to marry him if conversion was required. Even better if she could have enticed her husband to convert to Christianity.
@freeiker
so the majority of Christians are servants of satan?
i read his blog Rick thomas he said there are no roles in marriage and men and women just need to figure it out….
do they pretend verses in the bible do not exist?
It seems Japan has the same problems as the West:
http://jasminelholmes.com/what-about-titus-2/
this article is going around the Gospel coalition authors.
She is boasting about how she does not care for her home and how looking after the home is not for men and historically both men and women lived in egalitarian lifestyles and worked ina gender neutral form…
She made her husband do the hard work of cooking ( lol hard…) all week- keep in mind she does not work
why does these men stick around?
for those thinking older women wont find husbands
http://courtneyreissig.com/blog/2018/1/8/raising-sons-in-a-boys-will-be-boys-world
she is training all her sons to eternally serve women
these women will find husbands
http://jasminelholmes.com/homemaking-not-important-part-identity/
remember she speaks for CBMW
here she boasts on how lazy she is
@bdash 77,
You have correctly identified how some of these “traditional/conservative” Christian leaders have wives that work outside the home instead of helpmeeting their husbands.
Another factor to observe is how many natural children these couple have. 3 children is replacement; unless they have 4 or more they are not physically growing the kingdom of God.
these women will find husbands
Sure but that’s a combination of (1) “the thirst” and (2) the fact that most men have a better chance of satisfying “the thirst” in a marriage than outside of one (even if the marriage is low sex), because lots of guys are getting very little sex in the current market. (This holds for “Christian” guys too, because despite everything, Christians are getting it on before they get married pretty much like everyone else in this culture, barring exceptional cases).
Jeff Strand didn’t say that Banks was disgusting because she married a Jew, but because she converted to Judaism for his sake. She traded Christ for worldly success.
Jewish guys who marry shiksas often require that they convert. She will still always be a shiksa, but if he wants to be involved in the Jewish community at all, period, he can’t be married to someone who is actually a Christian — that’s just not accepted. It’s a visceral thing — it’s just not accepted.
Of course if he didn’t care about being involved in the Jewish community and so on, then he wouldn’t care, and there are plenty of secular jews who marry non-jews who don’t worry about anything like this. But if you are a jew who wants to be involved in the jewish community, you absolutely may not marry someone who is a Christian — it is not accepted.
http://jasminelholmes.com/what-about-titus-2/
this article is going around the Gospel coalition authors.
She is boasting about how she does not care for her home and how looking after the home is not for men and historically both men and women lived in egalitarian lifestyles and worked ina gender neutral form…
She made her husband do the hard work of cooking ( lol hard…) all week- keep in mind she does not work
An excellent example of churchians openly spitting on the Scriptures that don’t conform to or support their modernist, worldly lifestyles. This woman knows that she is in the wrong, but is pretty much flipping God the bird and defying Him to punish her for disobeying Him. That she does so so blatantly gives you some idea of how prevelent she and her ilk are and how far astray the “church” has gone.
Not that they really believe in God, or that anything His Scriptures say is truly His word, but those same Scriptures that they’re spitting on tell them that God will be having a very unpleasant one-way “chat” with them on Judgment Day about their current behavior before He dispatches them to a place that they either don’t truly believe exists or that they will never in a million years have to worry about themselves.
why does these men stick around?
Like I said, they’re thirsty, cowardly pussybeggars who fear (wo)man far more than they fear God (who they too probably don’t really believe exists either). Such obsequious spinelessness is to be expected from that type. One day they’ll figure out (too late, of course) that their wives loathe them for being the doormat castrati they’ve chosen to be.
Went dancing last night (and this morning) stumbled home sore, tired, soaked in sweat…….and grabbed a few hours of sleep. At work waiting for the tea to kick in……..
Perhaps I am older / wiser, perhaps I don’t care, perhaps I know just where I stand in the world on the “looks” totem pole and I have accepted this. It doesn’t matter.
I’m out on the floor……..doing the usual shuffle / slide soul step. A hot mid-twenty something year old gal…..shoves me……..SHOVES ME outta her way as she is getting on the floor:
I danced over to her. Shoved / checked her back.Not hard, but she felt it and knew it was done outta spite. She lost her balance, spilled some of her drink and I shuffled back away and gave the dad / adult look to her of “don’t you do that to me ever again. this scene is my scene. I’m here to dance. you’re here to twerk”
She immediately gets the bouncer (tattling…all these modern women ALWAYS tattle to a man when they get called out….she now has to get a man to do her bidding). The bouncer (a big dude), he just laughs at her…..she spent the next hour with her pack of girlfriends shooting me seething looks of hate at me.
I had a great time…….came home, took a shower……made a triple strength tea and now I am at work. I feel great, a bit sore…….I’m not a young cat anymore when it comes to dancing…….but I always feel better after a night of hard soul.
……..as for “conservative” and “bold” churches like Chandlers I always laugh. These guys are so deluded.
Jason, you tone-deaf dork, she wanted your number.
Talent on the dance floor is always wasted on the wrong people… I swear ta gawd.
Michelle Langley made an observation that part of the reason for women’s anger and depression is that — even though they can easily get their family, friends, co-workers, politicians, media, and virtually all of society to rally around them and back her up on making men the culprit – they cannot spin the story enough to truly convince themselves. I think churches can be added to the mix as well.
There are few people more angry and depressed than those who are never held responsible for their actions. It’s easily to complain about deadbeat dads, it’s harder to ask women why they let losers ejaculate in them.
Interesting that the bouncer just laughed at her highness.. That’s awesome! A man in a position like that is sure to know what these stupid young princesses are all about. Seems she was pissed the rest of the evening to discover her privilege wasn’t as vast as she assumed it was. Maybe she can skip that club from now on and try her luck finding white knights elsewhere. If Game is on the ground anywhere it should be on the dance floors.
New injustice exposed: most villains in children’s books are male: https://www.theguardian.com/books/2018/jan/21/childrens-books-sexism-monster-in-your-kids-book-is-male
Male characters are twice as likely to take leading roles in children’s picture books and are given far more speaking parts than females, according to Observer research that shines a spotlight on the casual sexism apparently inherent in young children’s reading material. …
… male villains were eight times more likely to appear compared to female villains. Only one book, Peppa and her Golden Boots, portrayed a sole female villain, acting alone: a duck who steals Peppa Pig’s boots and takes them to the moon.
Why are feminists complaining about the prevalence of male villains in children’s picture books? From the article:
“It is preparing children to see male dominance as normal, so that when women do less than half of the talking, that feels like too much to some people. And with so few female roles, there’s also not enough space for the female characters to be multi-dimensional. I think the lack of female villains reflects a wider cultural discomfort with women who are not well-behaved and good.”
Please. She was clearly looking for the D. I’ve seen these hoez a thousand times. They love an older brother with good moves on the floor. The fact that Jason scoffed at her only intensified the tingles.
@Boxer
Nahhh. At this soul-stomp there are always a bunch of younger women who just want to hear funk / grind music. I wish the DJ’s would stay on a more pure scene like it was a few years back. I might add, slowly……more and more women are showing up. When this “soul club / scene” started back in 2014 here in Fresno…..it was 90% men. Practicing moves, forgetting about the dead end job, relaxing, enjoying really solid music. A pretty balanced crowd of black, white and latin guys mostly Most of the women who do come, don’t dance. They sway to the music in heels that are not made for soul-stomps, twerk and grind on the good looking men when they get drunk usually to the funk stuff that is sometimes played. All of them have their ginormous purses on them as well……I danced with one girl to a mid tempo in Nvember……..she was like dragging a statue around on the floor.
Every white girl *thinks* she can dance, and the truth is they can’t. Most can’t.
To this music I can. I’m good. The brotha’s always pat me on the butt, or high five me “white boy cuts it up tight and hard.” I’m so clueless to what “flirting” means by women. I also am old enough to be “dad” to most of them who do show up……and I’,m a Christian. I’m not gonna meet a “believer” on the dance floor at a scene like this. It’s a place where I can dance, get a workout to music I love deeply. A heavy, deep and real experience for me men. I also don’t drink or drug anymore….and the music still sounds great sober….my dancing improved ten-fold since 2007 since quitting that nonsense
“I’m Gone!” Eddie Parker (early 1967)
Why are feminists complaining about the prevalence of male villains in children’s picture books?
Women get gina tingles from villains. There is no more to it than that.
That is why the strict control of women was essential to civilizational progress. Since this is unlikely in the modern age, the next most like outcome is increasing female obsolescence.
It’s amazing how just by not doing that…I’m not creating more single mothers and illegitmate children.
Perhaps brother Jed should ask the deadbeat mothers why they choose cads to be fathers of their illegitmate children.
She was looking for a cad to help her become a single mother so that 10 years down the road she would be highlighted on Boxer’s blog on the newest way some deadbeat mother killed her children.
You did good Jason to keep your future children out of peril.
Boxer’s Blog: Where folks come for the snuff stories, and stay for the epistemology.
https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/article/at-home-work-not-just-for-women/
here is another one, here she teaches wives that looking after the home is not their responsibility the husband must help.
Also role reversal is fine….
What has happened? Are there no Godly women that think that this is helping their husbands?
What if husbands decided to tell the wife while in labour- Go work I am tired!
complaining about housework just screams laziness.
Every husband I’ve ever known, throughout my entire life, has done housework. The garbage gets removed by the husband, and weekly pulled to the curb. The lawn gets mowed by the husband. The cars get washed by the husband. The house gets painted by many husbands, every year or two. If there’s a flat tire, who goes and fixes it?
Feminist complaints are just dumb, unless they want to start doing the dirty/heavy stuff too…
@boxer
exactly?
yet these women keep screaming about how they cannot even manage their homes…
why would a man marry such an unsupportive wife?
What has happened? Are there no Godly women that think that this is helping their husbands?
What if husbands decided to tell the wife while in labour- Go work I am tired!
complaining about housework just screams laziness.
Once again, to amplify Anon’s point about female obsolescence:
Any woman who refuses to fulfill her God-given, God-mandated role as wife, helpmeet, and mother, or who refuses to make that role her first priority in life, is indeed obsolete and superfluous and does not merit the expenditure of ANY resources for her sustainment. The only exception is if she foresakes such roles in order to dedicate her life to serving God in a state of poverty and celibacy (i.e., a nun). To otherwise reward her for abandoning her primary role is to reward her sins.
Feminist complaints are just dumb, unless they want to start doing the dirty/heavy stuff too…
Tbey should be made to do it. That’s what the equality tbey’ve been screaming for demands (“anything any man can do, I can do better!” “Great, bitch. Let’s see you PROVE that. The tire iron and jack are in the tool chest. You’ll have move it to open it, and it weighs 300 pounds.Happy lifting!”).
Only a hopeless, pathetic, desperate white knight does any ‘heavy lifting” for a feminist.
yet these women have heaps of husbands- Courtner ressig for example, her husband looks after the 5 kids so she can travel around the country and write books about being a Godly woman…
I see this men at church as well- they are never allowed to meet their friends or take a break from work or rest, if they are of work they need to be doing childcare housework else the wife will be angry and he is not a good enough husband….
@bdash77
What is the point you are trying to prove? Or what are you trying to get to the bottom to?
I am just confused
are these people not true Christians?
The Gospel Coalition, Acts 29 etc
they are a huge part of conservative christianity
it just shocks me i guess that they sneak in feminism.
and I am struggling to accept it!
Wendy Griffith, Age 53
Wow… She was burning the candle at both ends 18+ years ago… And she’s still waiting… She’s going to die before any guy is dumb enough to saddle himself with that old-nag…
And contrary to what all of the feminists want to shout about, being a man and 50+ you’re still in the game – depending on what game you’re playing. I’ve never been looking for anything longer than a couple of months, but in my mid-50’s I’m still enjoying life, and women less than half my age. Of course, that’s all thanks to what has been drilled into their heads by older women, about enjoying life when they are young. Best thing that ever happened to men. And the fact that they are all looking for older male acceptance, is just icing on the cake…
You have to have things down, and do things that bring a lot of women that you, like into places where you are the center of attention. But you can’t go wrong, and young women want something fast that won’t follow them home, which is wonderful for the man that wants the same things. Half the time I don’t even know their name, or their contact information, which is why the ones in relationships are the best. But who cares – I get what I want and am on my way…
But for longer-term things there are other things you can do to get those types of women – if you want them. There are lots out there and these days they are more than willing to share – as long as you lay down the law early, and walk if they don’t play nice. But this woman, passed her expiration date almost 20 years ago…
bdash,
Almost all pastors preach for a living. THAT is the problem right there. They don’t have another job (even though they should have a job.) As such, they need to eat and feed their family. That doesn’t happen if the church is empty. They need a full church and need people paying their tithes. Because of “threatpoint” the WIFE selects the church, not the husband. And of course, (since she has been eating apples from the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil all her life) she is going to pick the one that is the most feminist, the one with full churchianity.
It is what it is.
If the pastor did this as a volunteer service, preached the true Good News of Christ on the weekends and did another job (for pay) during the week, he wouldn’t care if people didn’t stay. They could leave. It would be fine. Find that church, feminism will not be there.
BS. People don’t like to be rejected. It sounds like a great idea, but the idea that only part time pastors are good has a number of huge holes.
@innocentbystanderboston
If that is true why is Courtney Reissig encouraging feminism
Her husband is an unpaid pastor who works full time
yet he quietly also plays little homemaker so Courtney can travel around the country preaching to women…
and Courntey tells all the women to not feel guilty for not having a clean house or supporting her husband!!
What is threatpoint?
Is it when Christians say husbands must servant lead- aka obey the wife?
If Churches are built on female attraction
then are not women naturally leaders?
Surely a redpill church would be popular?
Billy, needing to be PAID creates a natural conflict of interest for a preacher. You can’t preach the truth AND demand to be paid for it if the majority of the people in the church aren’t the least bit interested in hearing the truth. Most women can’t handle the truth about Christ. They can’t. They embrace the Serpent, not Jesus. And because they have “threatpoint” the husband “submits.”
Bdash, I don’t know anything about Courtney, and I don’t care. The majority of Protestant churches are feminist centric, churchiantiy.
Read and learn and know it.
https://dalrock.wordpress.com/2012/04/14/threatpoint/
In the late 1960s, women had the right to leave their husbands simply because they weren’t happy BUT they left with the shirt on their back. They couldn’t get a “divorce” without cause, without real physical violence or adultery. So because they want the house, the kids, and his income (and they can’t get it) wives who were unhappy were committing suicide. 2nd wave feminism wanted to fix the suicide rate of women who were unhappily married stuck because they couldn’t leave, and they came up with “no fault divorce” which allowed women to UNILATERALY leave their husband and take cash and prizes. THAT creates the “threatpoint.” No husband has to do whatever she says and keep her happy or she brings down the sword and collects cash and prizes. This reduces the female suicide rate but the male suicide rate went way up (and still does.)
This website is the only red pill church that I am aware of….
Thanks for the link!
How do you learn to not care about feminist churches/ authors etc
I just feel sad for all the men being trained to be slaves to women…
not to mention all the children being raised seeing that there is no difference between male and female so it is fine to be transgender gay etc
@thedeti, @matt
A variant of this solution was proposed somewhere for the problem of finding a husband. Because her time is limited, a woman cannot possibly assess 1/e (37%) of all the possible candidates. Instead she should spend the first 37% of her fertile years doing so, and then marry the best candidate who exceeds all the earlier ones. If her fertile years are reckoned as 16 to 40, the first phase of her search should not continue past the age of 24.
Some of the pitfalls are obvious and all too human. A woman might stop “assessing” and enter a long-term relationship that does not lead to marriage: this simply wastes her time. She might not start assessing candidates until much later than 16, because she is focused on her education and career.
Hypergamy would tend to lengthen her search; a knowledge that the number of available candidates is shrinking ought to shorten it.
However, if she is still looking for a husband at 53, obviously she has blown it.
best candidate -> first candidate
Dear James K,
Spending age 16-24 “assessing” available candidates is known here as “riding the carousel.”
No candidate after this 37% will be “better”; any “better” candidate is looking for goods that have not been “sampled” by 5-10 (conservative estimate) previous candidates.
Most likely outcome is to settle for a candidate who is below previous experiences, hence “alpha widowhood.” Next most likely outcome is spinster party cat girl.
Trying to use the secretary problem as a solution is what got women into this mess to begin with.
The only reasonable cure is arranged marriages.
The only reasonable cure is arranged marriages.
There are many drawbacks to this.
i) What if you are not compatible at all? Sexually or otherwise?
ii) In such societies, both men and women put no effort into their attractiveness. One could say that this is ‘good’, as the time and resources are saved. But come on.
iii) Such a society is extremely vulnerable to disruption from contact with a more libertine society.
The truth is, marriage worked when poverty was more widespread. Furthermore, women aren’t really useful for too many roles in modern society, particularly since people don’t have 8 kids anymore.
Marriage is on its way out. Plus, women are obsolete.
They are.
The feminist led ones are seeing their numbers plummet. How long can you call yourself a Christian if your denomination has a lesbian bishop saying Jesus was a bigot and think incorporating Islam is a good idea?
Reminds me of an old Twilight Zone episode about ‘The Obsolete Man’
@earl
yes but the complementarian ones are growing…
IBB,
I think I will believe Paul and the Epistles rather than your assertions.
You have yet to prove your point, you just assert it. The early Apostles devoted themselves fully to prayer and the Word. Some later worked as necessary, but that was not the norm from what we are told. (Where it is explicitly noted at least.)
Put up some Scriptural support for your assertion please.
The only reasonable cure is arranged marriages.
It’s worth noting that arranged marriages are distinct from forced marriages. The former is (typically) arranged between the parents, but the man and woman both have a veto; in the latter, there is no choice/veto for at least one party.
I think arranged marriages would solve more problems than they create.
Paul was. Tent maker. He “boasted” about not having to use his right of “dont muzzle the ox as it reads the grain”
Its the same cops or any authority failing to do what they are suppose to do bescause fear of loosing pensions or along that line. I think that is the spirit of what IBB was getti g at
Well … if she is 53 and not married yet, she might’ve done something wrong.
I am absolutely positive about that.
@ Billys
1 Corinthians 9:15
Since Paul supported himself, he was free to preach the truth. Pastors who are dependent on their church for a salary, MAY end up telling the congrigation what they want to hear out of fear of loosing his job, which he is dependent on to pay rent and food and needs ect…
Harder to buy a man when he isnt in need. Hard to be in need when you already providing for yourself
Harder to buy a man when he isnt in need. Hard to be in need when you already providing for yourself
Truer words were never spoken. This is why it is vital to work towards self-employment. In Paul’s time this was easier but in the era of mass manufacturing, it’s a lot harder. Still, pursuing a vocation that demands technical skill is the right way to go.
In my limited experience, I think women get decision paralysis because they worry too much about whether they feel in love first – but feelings of love come from genuinely giving ourselves and women aren’t thinking in terms of giving all they can to a man. We need to ask ourselves if we can give ourselves (not just physically) to this man for a lifetime, not ‘do I feel in love’. – Which is really another way of saying ‘what does he do for me to make me feel happy’; followed by, ‘now i’m unhappy so it is his fault’ and divorce.
The main purpose of marriage is to have children. What place does that idea have in this woman’s scribblings? Zero. She is clueless but a fine emissary for a culture with literally no future.
“Remember that it takes a considerably higher level of intellectual enlightenment to see that misandry is the greatest evil of our age. Crude racism/tribalism is the currency of those who haven’t evolved since 10,000 BC…”
Allow me to translate: “Please be to stop noticing things, dumbdumb-sahib! This is most needful. No wrong thinkings, white stupids, thank you.”
Entertaining errant utopian abstractions, sexual and political– pretense– and epicene paralysis when faced with malactors– permissiveness,– on the part of white Christians, is the heart of western dysfunction.
It’s not just about bad girls. Like… duh, omygawd.
Matthew advises discernment, worldly savvy, and avoidance of harm:
“16 Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and as harmless as doves. 17 But beware of men: for they will deliver you up to the councils, and they will scourge you in their synagogues; 18 And ye shall be brought before governors and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them and the Gentiles. 19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak. 20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.
21And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death. 22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.”
23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.”
In other words, “Notice when others hate you and try to hurt you. There is no universal, autistic nonspecifiedgenderhood-of-numales. Don’t cuck.”
“It’s not just about bad girls.”
But I guess it is on this blog. I’ll leave it at that.
I think women get decision paralysis because they worry too much about whether they feel in love first
True. Very true.
A female friend of mine, a professed Christian, once told me how she usually made decisions even to go out with a man, and I couldn’t believe it. One of the questions she would ask herself was: “Can I picture sleeping with this man, ever?”
It surprised me that women think that far ahead even before they get to know a man.
Truer words were never spoken. This is why it is vital to work towards self-employment. In Paul’s time this was easier but in the era of mass manufacturing, it’s a lot harder…..
Believe it or not, it is much easier today to become self-employed, especially for those in non-manufacturing areas.
Every preacher has a message. They can write and publish books, and sell worldwide from their websites or on amazon. Anyone can become a self-publisher these days. They can maintain blogs, youtube videos (monetized). etc.
Learning IT for instance costs peanuts. There are tons of free tools, and free books out there in their thousands. Kids these days unilaterally develop software which often become .
There are free schools online where one can learn new skills. The opportunities are endless for those who really want to take them.
* software which often become successful.
Paul was. Tent maker. He “boasted” about not having to use his right of “dont muzzle the ox as it reads the grain”
Exactly.
Jesus was a carpenter. Peter was a fisherman. The other disciples almost certainly had experience in a trade or profession. The pastor of my church is an experienced automotive mechanic. The pastor of my fiancee’s church in her home country was an attorney by training.
The point is that these men had/have practical skills with which they could earn a livelihood while preaching the Word as a CALLING.
Too many “pastors” today are, to put it bluntly, incapable of doing anything practical and useful and attended seminary right out of high school because it was the only training they had any hope of completing (they have a lot in common here with public school teachers). They have ZE-RO experience in real-world work because they would drown if ever put into the position of having to doing anything productive to earn their keep.
In short, the pulpit has become a form of welfare for weak-willed and weak-minded men without any other options in life. This why they “sing for their supper” to congregations full of worldly people over whom they have no real influence and who generally have no respect for them.
Paul was only a tentmaker for a short period. He asserted the right for those who preach the Gospel to make a living by the Gospel, even though he did what was needed at times.
Jesus was not a carpenter during His ministry years feeriker. We have no evidence He built a single thing in all that time. Some considered Him a carpenter because that is what He had done, not because of His current ongoing action.
Using Jesus as an example would negate the point, since the carpenter ceased when the full devotion to ministry began.
Too many take one Scripture and stretch it beyond belief. Ignoring 1 Cor 9:14 to use the following verse for the opposite point is dishonest. Paul laid out the principle and then noted he did not force it. He did not say the principle was that he should have done ministry on the side as the claims are.
This is similar to the argument that having several wives can deal with the problem of a rebellious wife. The idea sounds interesting at first, but fails in practice.
A minister should work to support himself until his work can support him. He should of course never cater to the voices of others in what he preaches, only the voice of God. Too many will give into the voice of others no matter where the exact income comes from. Humans are subject to being human.
We can see in today’s world that SJWs can get you fired for speaking wrongly. How would the part time leader that is being extolled avoid that? They could be even more vulnerable, if you carry the logic out.
tldr: No situation will magically prevent men from being stupid.
Please also note that none of what I write guarantees that any specific individual should really be a pastor. That is a completely separate issue. The method of support is independent of the true calling.
Right and wrong at the same time. I have been working in IT my entire professional life (around 20 years). Came to the US as a highly qualified IT professional and this way got my Green Card.
You CAN easily be an entrepreneur, but you CANNOT easily make money (I am talking at least about 100k) that way in IT. As in most other occupations the way for most people now is to learn hard and then work for someone else who can pay for your skills. But the problem is – they require COMMITMENT. They may give you some freedom (working from home once a week) but it still a high level commitment on their terms.
Speaking of pastors, has anyone noticed how far the modern church has drifted from the examples of the NT Christians?
For instance, there was never a totally independent pastor in those days. Every pastor was accountable to the apostolic leadership in some way. Even the Apostles were accountable to each other, and there was no “senior” apostle among them.
Peter had to report his visit to Cornelius’s house to the other apostles, because they took him to task, and demanded he explain his reasons for going into the house of a Gentile.
Paul said he rebuked Peter “before them all” when he failed to set a good example. Paul himself gave account of his missionary journeys to the other apostles.
In other words, I saw a pattern of leadership in the apostolic times that were completely different from what we have today.
These days, anyone could simply start a church/ministry/religious organization, and be unaccountable to no one, though he may demand that members listened to him, and pay him.
Who do people like Kenneth Copeland, TD Jakes, or Joel Osteen accountable to?
I’d hazard a guess that they are the “Senior pastors”, and cannot be challenged by anyone in their organizations.
Regarding : the purpose of marriage is to have children.
No, it is not, at least not so for Christians. Read carefully what St Paul writes in 1 Co 7.
“Now to the unmarried and the widows I say: It is good for them to stay unmarried, as I do. But if they cannot control themselves, they should marry, for it is better to marry than to burn with passion.”
The text before talks about man and wife should be having sex if one of them so desires, to combat sexual immorality (note, NOT only when BOTH feel the need for sex, only when ONE feels the need for sex, the other should willingly give his/her body for pleasure)
“But since sexual immorality is occurring, each man should have sexual relations with his own wife, and each woman with her own husband.”
I.e. it is BETTER to *not* marry (and NOT have children), ONLY IF you cannot control your sexual urges, you should *marry* (to be able to have SEX when you so desire, not necessarily to have children, although these CAN follow from sex)
It’s amazing how this simple and obvious teaching is overlooked by e.g. the Roman Catholic Church.
@ Dave
Believe it or not, it is much easier today to become self-employed, especially for those in non-manufacturing areas.
I’m not sure if that’s true to be honest. There are plenty of gigs one can do however the competition is so fierce that it’s difficult, if not outright impossible to make a living working online gigs. In pre-industrial society, production and consumption were strictly local, which ensured that without mass production and distribution, no one entity could monopolize the market. This is how Jesus and Paul were able to devote their lives to missionary work while their vocations were an afterthought. We don’t live in that world anymore.
Regarding the feminization of the church.
As in many cases, churches are usually FOLLOWERS of the dominant culture, instead of going against it. If you follow current culture, you follow feminism. Therefore you have to “reason away” all texts talking about:
– difference between man and woman
– different roles for man and woman
– headship of man over woman
– submission of woman to man
– teaching by man, not by woman (in some contexts)
– leadership by man, not by woman (in some contexts)
– sex only within marriage (between man and woman)
– sex on demand, the other party jumping in to do his/her marital *duty*
A favorite “counterargument” is to declare all these texts to be fully dependent on the culture of the 1st century, and hey presto! No need to follow these texts at all.
Of course you then have to ignore that the church was going AGAINST 1st century culture, and several texts refer to the original creation before the fall happened as justification, but hey, who cares? If only we *feel* right about it.
On the other hand, there is nothing to be surprised about; the Lord Jesus himself warned about people becoming lovers of self, not be able to listen to truth, nor follow Him.
1 Pet 2:20b-21
But if you suffer for doing good and you endure it, this is commendable before God. *To this you were called*, because Christ suffered for you, leaving you an *example*, that you should *follow in his steps*.
Tell me, how many churches do you know that tell their followers to suffer for Christ?
As an aside to all the statistics; have a look at the story of how Isaac found his wife (Gen 24).
Abraham sent his servant to find a wife for his son Isaac. The servant prays when he arrives in the region where he was sent: “Lord, God of my master Abraham, make me successful today, and show kindness to my master Abraham. See, I am standing beside this spring, and the daughters of the townspeople are coming out to draw water. May it be that when I say to a young woman, ‘Please let down your jar that I may have a drink,’ and she says, ‘Drink, and I’ll water your camels too’—let her be the one you have chosen for your servant Isaac. By this I will know that you have shown kindness to my master.”
And hey presto!
Before he had finished praying, Rebekah came out with her jar on her shoulder. [..] The woman was very beautiful, a virgin; no man had ever slept with her. She went down to the spring, filled her jar and came up again. The servant hurried to meet her and said, “Please give me a little water from your jar.”“Drink, my lord,” she said, and quickly lowered the jar to her hands and gave him a drink.After she had given him a drink, she said, “I’ll draw water for your camels too, until they have had enough to drink.” So she quickly emptied her jar into the trough, ran back to the well to draw more water, and drew enough for all his camels. Without saying a word, the man watched her closely to learn whether or not the Lord had made his journey successful.
By the grace of God, the servant found the wife for Isaac, first-time right!
Bdash, I hear you, regarding your observation of the conservative churches being wrong on patriarchy and helpmeets. That is a different topic than Wendy and the original post, so I won’t respond at length now, but I hope we can return to it more fully in a future post. I think it unfortunate that most conversations about that get distracted by a discussion of fem-led churches. At least Dalrock recognizes the problem and does a great job bringing our attention to the figureheadship being preached by truly consevative sources. I will leave you with this, my church was led by a writer at the Gospel Coalition and we don’t allow women elders or preaching, yet we are distinctly blue-pill. It is a vexing problem and you are right to point it out.
When I moved to Fresno from the ‘bay area’ the recession was in full swing…..and Californians know, even in “good times” its harder to land a job in the vast interior valley, mountains, deserts of this fine state.
I moved into a tiny in law house that I found on “craigslist” and paid rent for six months upfront. My land-girl told me “get a id / license with your Fresno address on it ASAP…..businesses and the like will hire someone with an “in town” ID over an out-of-town one.
I hustled for almost TWO YEARS with odd jobs from Craigslist, standing at Walmart during the harvest seasons for almonds, melons, tomatoes, and grapes waiting for day-work (farmers frequently picked up day labor on the free market at these places). You were paid below minimum, but you were paid CASH at the end of the day. During “raisin” season, even “Sunmaid” here in Fresno picked me up at a meeting point for separating work.
I also mowed lawns, cleaned swimming pools, and held it together. Sure, it was tough…..but I did manager to pay that rent every month…keep my hair freshly barbered every two weeks, keep the lights and the phone on. With no car. With no computer (I used the Fresno Library). I kept my clothes washed. Life was not glamorous…and me getting to eat McDonalds was a treat…….but I held fast and on. I stayed sober.
I can give glory to God here but what kept me alive was the fact of a very tidy work ethic that was instilled at home from birth by both my parents.
@Dave
If you are looking for churches that have hierarchal structure and thus accountability, I think the Catholics would qualify. I don’t know if Orthodox has a structure that goes worldwide. The LDS also have a structure similar to the way the catholics do.
@BillyS and feereker
This is a problem with potential conflict of interest. In the past may pastors were not supported directly by donations but often indirectly (benefactors, land grants). The direct connection between the donations of the members of a church and a pastor is an difficult corrupting influence. In my religion local leaders work their own jobs, but the people higher up in structure are supported by the members and work full time. There is not an easy solution – if your flock is a megachurch than its a huge full time job. Maybe that suggests there is something wrong with the megachurches…
@Earl and bdash
Almost all churches are sinking. The fruits of the education of our youth by the state is finally bearing serious fruit. Millennials leave their parents faith at 40-70% and leave to become agnostic. We have never seen a falloff this big before. They are the Godless generation and so many churches are going to shrink and die over time. I don’t know the numbers for Muslims in the US, but they may be one of the only growing religions in the US. The millennial get their spirituality from yoga and social justice ventures. The next 30 years are going to be interesting.
I don’t know if Orthodox has a structure that goes worldwide.
Yes, within each Orthodox Church. Orthodoxy is best viewed as a communion of patriarchal or national churches (e.g., Greece, Russia, Romania, Antioch Patriarchate, Jerusalem Patriarchate, etc). Orthodox in the US generally belong to parishes that belong to dioceses of one of these patriarchates or national churches from the Orthodox world (the one exception to this is the “Orthodox Church in America”, which was given ecclesial independence by Moscow in 1970, but most other Orthodox churches consider them to be a part of the Moscow Patriarchate).
Those that can make a living by teaching are called professors, practicing clinical psychologists, therapists, and life coaches; their skills are in enough demand that people pay to use them. Those that make a living by the Gospel are planting Churches in dangerous and risky locations and are paid as risk takers on temporary assignment.
The local pastor is mostly filling a timeslot that any man in the congregation with some public speaking training could do. If the congregation is paying for pro bono therapy and life coaching, you would think they would want skilled people in the role but most of the time no one engages to that degree or pays for the service somewhere else.
And now with the internet why keep a subpar local teacher paid when high level teachers put out their content for free; the NT doesn’t talk about technology reducing the need for “people living by the Gospel”. It is always assumed the correct level is whatever level that lets “me as a pastor” get paid and excludes others from entering too easily.
You get what you pay for.
Dave @ 8:14 am:
“For instance, there was never a totally independent pastor in those days. Every pastor was accountable to the apostolic leadership in some way.”
A difficult idea given the slow speed of communication in those days. Apollos was a devout yet misinformed evangelist.
…
Paul @ 9:24 am:
“As an aside to all the statistics; have a look at the story of how Isaac found his wife (Gen 24).”
Did you actually read that story?
Abraham said to his chief of staff, “Swear to me that you will not miscegenate my bloodline. Take a caravan to the Old Country and buy my son a wife from my own people. Here’s a suitcase with $10 million for a bride price.”
They are following the Boomer example of not taking religion seriously. They just care less about appearances and so actually stop going to church. I’m a Millennial.
Good for a laugh:
Need to make a copy someplace more permanent. Not sure if this will work if you are not logged into disqus.
Kevin,
Being obligated to a single individual providing the backing can also lead to conflicts of interest. It could be good if the individual is faithful, but bad otherwise. No human situation is perfect.
I understand why some pastors “tickle itching ears,” but I cannot see how I would ever do that, were I to ever be a pastor. (That is HIGHLY unlikely.) I would preach the Word as accurately as I could. I would never compromise and would go down doing that if necessary. All do not share that trait.
Here you go:
https://v5k2c2.wordpress.com/2018/01/22/your-daily-bible-reading/
You should be able to “save as” the .jpeg to your own computer or mobile device.
@ BillyS
I think you are mistaken about Paul and sort of missing the point. Was he a tent maker only a short time? Maybe. Did he make tents while ministerimg, thays how we know he was a tent maker. What about the 1 Corinthians 9:15? How serious was Paul when he wrote that he would rather die than let anyone deprive him of his boast [in providing for himself]
Paul did recieve money/resources for the church, not for himself. He provided for his own meeds to set an example to other believers saying to them “he who doesnt work shouldnt eat”
Paul continued to provide for himself well through out his ministry. Did he do it solely through tent making? I wouldt be surprised if he syill made a few tents in his later life. Your statement that he did it temporarily has no basis in the new testament
It’s more amazing that people don’t get that sex may lead to procreation…because guess what…God said ‘be fruitful and multiply’. It’s both uniative and open to the possibility of life. You can’t seperate what God has created it to be for.
http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p2s2c3a7.htm
The openness to fertility
1652 “By its very nature the institution of marriage and married love is ordered to the procreation and education of the offspring and it is in them that it finds its crowning glory.”
Children are the supreme gift of marriage and contribute greatly to the good of the parents themselves. God himself said: “It is not good that man should be alone,” and “from the beginning [he] made them male and female”; wishing to associate them in a special way in his own creative work, God blessed man and woman with the words: “Be fruitful and multiply.” Hence, true married love and the whole structure of family life which results from it, without diminishment of the other ends of marriage, are directed to disposing the spouses to cooperate valiantly with the love of the Creator and Savior, who through them will increase and enrich his family from day to day.
1653 The fruitfulness of conjugal love extends to the fruits of the moral, spiritual, and supernatural life that parents hand on to their children by education. Parents are the principal and first educators of their children. In this sense the fundamental task of marriage and family is to be at the service of life.
1654 Spouses to whom God has not granted children can nevertheless have a conjugal life full of meaning, in both human and Christian terms. Their marriage can radiate a fruitfulness of charity, of hospitality, and of sacrifice.
Paul wasn’t paranoid about receiving support. He would not have noted the clear principle in 1 Cor 9:14 if he was. His point was that he would not let anything stop him from his task and that he did not wait for others to validate him. Nowhere did he claim that being a tentmaker made him holier in and of itself.
Ministrers who are truly ministering should be able to live by the Gospel. Note that it is “should” not “must”. Giving up that right has merit for specific purposes, but not as a general principle.
Paul stated the principle then noted why he didn’t push for it. More depth there than a simple “have an occupation” assertion some claim. But believe what you wish. Don’t let the truth stand in the way of that.
That depth is what you ignored when responding to IBB.
Pastors whos sole income is through the chuch IS a conflict of interest. You are correct that it is their right to be paid by the church but does not mean that a conflict of interest does not exist.
If pastors today modelled their ministry after Paul, we would see a lot less olsteens, and other pastors who do it for money. Paul states that the gospel should not be used for financial gain and that there were even people during Pauls time using it for financial gain.
Pauls approach is more pure and less conflict of interest.
@Okrahead
Some of us can still imagine dating without the carousel!
As for arranged marriages, they might be feasible as long as the candidates have a veto. However, the difficulties are huge. Many families will not know anyone suitable for their son or daughter. Professional matchmakers have the same problem as dating agencies: they can only introduce people who are on their books. I will not even suggest that arrangements could be made by the pastor at Sunday Morning Nightclub.
“Who do people like Kenneth Copeland, TD Jakes, or Joel Osteen accountable to?
I’d hazard a guess that they are the “Senior pastors”, and cannot be challenged by anyone in their organizations.”
The scourge of the modern, independent megachurch. The only thing that can do these “pastors” in is mass abandonment of their flocks, which is why they will always be preached what they want to hear: prosperity, health, good fortune, etc. Seldom will they be to pick up their crosses and follow the Lord.
In the Presbyterian form of church government (I am in a conservative Presbyterian denomination), the pastor is part of a larger group of pastors and church elders from a dozen or more churches, called the presbytery, who are all accountable to each other. Though a local congregation calls the pastor, he in fact is answerable not to the local congregation for his teaching and leadership, but to the presbytery. The presbytery even approves the financial package for the called pastor (and although the local church is responsible after that for salary adjustments, he can appeal to the presbytery if he feels he is being unfairly compensated). This largely insulates the pastor from coming under the thumb of large donors. The congregation can also appeal to the presbytery if they feel his teaching is unbiblical or heretical.
This works well if all the pastors in the presbytery are nearly peers, but can have bad consequences if there is a superstar pastor. We had a pastor who is a popular evangelical author in our presbytery for awhile. Fortunately, he left for a bigger pond before too many adverse effects set in. He’s now teaching at a reformed college in the southeast, with others that are more in his peer group as far as fame and influence.
Choice addiction is a fascinating concept given the now free reign of female hypergamy in post-modern, western society.
I reminds me of a joke that a Russian work colleague of mine told me around 1994 shortly after the dissolution of the USSR. It was about the difference in social attitudes among Russians versus their American friends, and how the differences could not be more stark.
The “joke” went as follows, that there was an American airline passenger sitting in economy class cabin looking forward at those people enjoying their Business and First class status and seating.
That American of course would typically think to himself: “What must I do to earn/afford a seat up there in First or Business class with all of them?”
The Soviet passenger sitting next to the American looks upon the same First and Business class passengers as well. But his thoughts are different: “What must I do to get all of those fucking assholes in First Class sitting back here in Economy class next to me!!??”
With respect to choice addiction, it’s my observation that women do indeed relish amongst themselves any kind of jealousy-invoking, “in yo’ face”, “oneupwomanship”. Taking that top tier guy down the aisle before her rivals do is a perfect example.
However, there is perhaps one thing women enjoy even more so, and that is Schadenfreude (finding joy in the misfortunes of others), especially their female rivals and ex-husbands.
The more attractive and desired those individuals would be, the more intense her Schadenfreude.
@swanny river
yes you are right. I got furious at a pastor for preaching that men should vaccum and clean ( said nothing about it to women)
a man serves by providing protecting and leading , if cleaning needs to be done it gets done but its not his priority….
he also said it was a sin for a man to expect to provide and to expect his wife to care for the home.
you are right it is a little side tracked….
but
if Pastors can do such manipulation
https://rickthomas.net/ – this was the pastor
it is only a matter of time before they start guilting men into marrying 53 year old sluts…
as always under the guise of servant leadership
@bdash77
Scrolling through the Rick Thomas link I saw this –
“I wonder how many wives have thought through how to be an asset to their husbands by humbly leading them while submitted to them.”
Interesting concept. Leading the husband while submitted to him sounds illogical on its face but also sounds like church lady gold, with all the bases covered.
Rick Thomas says in his bio that his father was a drunk, that he and his brothers ended up in jail, that he later married and went to seminary, and that while there his wife left him; among other things.
@ lost patrol
yes but he still teaches that men show servant leadership by caring for the home to support the wife’s gifts- his assistant then went on to scold the men and told them in front of their wives to clean and vacuum so the wife has time to pursue her calling…
even though it did not work for him- he tells everyone else that men need to be slaves and wives need to eglas while submitting
if I did around enough I am sure I will find a sermon telling single men to man up and marry 53 year old Griffith
this idea that she could never find a husband is wrong
Christian Pastors will find a way
Lost Patrol
“I wonder how many wives have thought through how to be an asset to their husbands by humbly leading them while submitted to them.”
Backleading. That’s what it’s called in the dancing world (ballroom, tango, jitterbug, etc.)
Interesting concept. Leading the husband while submitted to him sounds illogical on its face but also sounds like church lady gold, with all the bases covered.
Well, to be a bit cruder, this is also called “Topping from the bottom”.
Rick Thomas says in his bio that his father was a drunk, that he and his brothers ended up in jail, that he later married and went to seminary, and that while there his wife left him; among other things.
Solipsism isn’t just for women. Every undergraduate psychology major I have ever known was a person who probably needed some hours of counseling with a real psychologist. Sometimes I wonder how many men go into a seminary in search of something, how many are just reacting against personal ghosts such as an absent or alcoholic father.
Emotionally walking wounded, acting out their own childhood trauma in endless drama.
AR
“Topping from the bottom”
Ha! From the world of bondage, how appropriate.
Risk factor, not conflict of interest.
One body, one head, one church. it is in the interest of both pastor and congregation to preach and develop holiness. The congregation feeding their pastor materially is a fair trade for him feeding them spiritually.
The risk is that the congregation is carnal and only wants their ears tickled. But that is a self-fixing problem. Pastor preaches the truth, and they will either repent and obey God, or not. They will then be faced with the decision to kick him out, or leave.
At that point, either God provides pastor with new church job, or the church transforms into a more Christian one, even if it ends up smaller. (or larger!)
Rick Thomas says in his bio that his father was a drunk…<
So many of these mangina pastorbators seem to have “daddy issues,” just like the women they pedestalize. That can’t be a coincidence.
Off Topic: Stone Age chicks were ugly.
The expectation…
… vs. the reality.
https://news.nationalgeographic.com/2018/01/archaeology-agvi-greek-stoneage-facial-reconstruction/
@ freeiker
my dad hds lots of dad issues- absent, alcoholic did not even pay for elementary school! or for clothes
Yet he is the leader, my mom earned 3 times him prior to marriage- post marriage she became a housewife and helped him with his work….
no gender egalitarian nonsense- heck my mom would not marry a man that refused to let her run a household and multiple home based businesses/volunteer church etc
My dad got his breakfast cooked every day, lunch cooked and packed every morning and fresh dinner no repeats… ( my mom used to do it with joy- cook him his favorite meals even if us kids hated them)
if my mom was sick he did everything without complaining
and us kids knew who was boss…
I do not think that is an excuse- daddy issues
They just like to submit to feminism
instead of the bible
i am baffled they claim to follow christ.
AF turns to BB as the used goods attempt to “stick the landing.”
fyi My mom never wanted to work because she knew how strong willed she was and she feared she would bully my dad is she was still working so she ensured she could not succumb to sinning easily
most women in Church hate her…
Good example bdash, it’s no wonder you are vexed. That just doesn’t exist anymore, even with the SAHMs in my consevative church (most). Scratch the surface and their disrespect and pride come flying up, and their eagerness to show they aren’t just a SAHM. Too bad they are discontented with a godly gift, but the whispers are too loud.
Back to topic: I am surprised someone else didn’t make this prediction about Wendy, that is, she will keep writing, but not for stringing dreams. I think it won’t be long until she writes that singleness was God’s will for her and it is great. I have a question for her, why would you think you would be discontented with an average looking but a zealous Christian man? Do you think assortive mating is God’s will? What do you think Wendy about Bdash’s mom giving up a career making 3 times as much? Was she a dumb and immature Christian?
Marx called this ressentiment (I think he took the general idea from Kierkegaard or Hegel).
They hate her because they’re envious. That’s the fuel for almost all female hatred of other women. Losers hate winners, the weak hate the strong, the inferior hate the superior. This will always be so.
Tell your ma hello from us. May she bask in the petty hatred of her lessers, and may it make her laugh.
Boxer
In the Salvation Army, pastors are Officers….and rank by the amount of time they have served in the Army. A Lieutenant is just out of the training college (here in the Western Territory, it is Crestmont College) down in southern California.
They are paid by the Territory, and have a set wage. Also health care, a pension, a vehicle allowance, a gas reimbursement, food allowance, furniture allowance. Smartphone (they always tell us that “Jesus would have had a smartphone” I call WHALE EXCREMENT on that). They also get vacation, retreats and councils and other perks. This is the problem.
It’s a profession. No longer a passion.
Now, to be fair……..it’s not a glamorous living, however………as an Officer you have a safety net. A decent one if truth be told. A net that MOST of the flock you are tending DOESN’T have
The problem lies within the framework…….each church (Corps) has a council that the Officer reports to….like a board. The reality in too many Corps today is that the council reports to the Officer. Dare you confront an Officer?????? You will now have the weight of the whole Territory upon you. Don’t you dare ever question God’s annoited! The Officer class is full of dead weight (and overweight Officers) that need to GO. They are there for a paycheck, and have tiny dying Corps. I have met some awesome, passionate driven Officers in the Army and their work, leadership SHOWS…just like in the “real” military.
I also have dealt with so many inept, spineless, men and women as well in these positions. These Officers are the ones to remind you frequently that they went to a “two year college” and they have a degree.
I remind them them that “The Salvaytion Army was brought to the USA by a 14 year-old-girl (1879). To India by 17 year old boy (1870) and to Canada by a 16 year old boy (1877). All were “soldiers” and all did ten fold the amount of work for almost zero pay.
Soldiers in The Salvation Army are the “rank and file members” of the Corps and greater Ar,my which is headquartered in London, England.
At least she looks like she’s a healthy weight.
Pit a stone age chick vs. what an ‘average’ American woman looks like.
hahahahahaha
Pit a stone age chick vs. what an ‘average’ American woman looks like.
Stone age chick just needs someone to take her to the orthodontist and she’ll be fine. Fix that under-bite and she will soften up and be a real competitor as Earl points out. She’s not even wearing any makeup yet.
Of course the dental work could also start a process that ends with a smart phone and one of those pink hats…
She’d be Nancy Kerrigan.
@thedeti Re: The Wall
Everyone hits the wall. It’s called aging.
If the wall didn’t exist, then prostitution and ‘alleged’ sexual harassment would come to an end.
@ Earl
Holy crap! You’re right!
They couldn’t have the reconstruction smile since they know women don’t smile, right?
seventiesjason says:
January 22, 2018 at 8:16 pm
Sounds like the Salvation Army is degenerating much like the U.S. Army.
These Officers are the ones to remind you frequently that they went to a “two year college” and they have a degree.
Few things today say “pathetic, worthless loser” like bragging about one’s academic or professional credentials. The proper response to someone’s chest thumping over having a certain degree or certification is “yeah, you and ten million other nobodies. And just like them, it didn’t do you a bit of good either. You still don’t know jack and, worse still, can’t DO jack.”
Pit a stone age chick vs. what an ‘average’ American woman looks like.
No contest. And despite her “hard” looks, it’s a pretty safe wager that stone age chick was NOT a man-hating psychobitch.
@Oscar : “vs reality”
It’s always good to keep a healthy skepsis against such “scientific” reconstructions, they allow for a LOT of artistic freedom to make the result comply with perceived “common” wisdom.
E.g. Neanderthal
vs human
vs. human
Charles Bronson in Death Hunt?
Like this?
https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSqV3UL3OtV_7SRsQYDngO8ffT22k7yDTj27SsggicVKh0lEzb_5w
(another try)
@ Paul
“It’s always good to keep a healthy skepsis against such ‘scientific’ reconstructions, they allow for a LOT of artistic freedom to make the result comply with perceived ‘common’ wisdom.”
In that case, I’ll stick with Raquel Welch’s artistic freedom.
Charles Bronson in Death Hunt?
Good call; a criminally underrated film.
@Oscar
Good choice!
Good call; a criminally underrated film.
Wha?!
Oh, yes I totally agree. For a second there I thought you fellows were saying White Buffalo.
Wendy in about 5 more years:
http://assets.amuniversal.com/19a1bba097cd012f2fe400163e41dd5b
bd seventy seven wrote:does that mean most christians are not really christian?
I Strefanasha answer, dead right. Jesus said strait is the gate and narrow the way and FEW there are who find it. christianity is a personal relationship with a supernatural being, not merely a law code comunity and cosmology, I know i am converted because of the dramatic nature of my damascus road experience almost exactly 40 years ago and I know i still am because of the dialogue with the Holy Spirit that continues daily leading me to repent of sin and persuading me to confess my unbelief with an honesty which as a legalist i have never grasped until recently and which the churches I know of (I too am a New Zealander) have not the slightest undertanding. IOW I have a real testimony that is ongoing and fresh. without that i would have fallen away to loss years ago or even remained an atheist ahd likely died of despair long since
I just discovered Dalrock through a referral, and I’m glad I did. Much of the commentary, and the articles, resonate with me. Sadly, I’ve found many sites in the manosphere and MGTOW realm to have strong animus towards men of faith, and older men (I’m 60). I grew up in evangelical Protestantism. For me, it was an inch deep and a mile wide. 20 years ago, at the then age of 40, and after reading patristics, I converted to the Eastern Orthodox Church (Antiochian Orthodox Church-Greek Church of Antioch). This woman’s commentary is indicative of what’s going on in many feminized evangelical churches. Forget the mainline Protestant denominations that are lost and dying out. Where I’m going with all of this, is this. Traditionalist Christian and conservative men, IMO, are generally instilled with a code of ethics, be it traditionalism, or biblically based, to treat women in a respectful manner. I’ll concede that many modern western women are nefarious at best. Case in point, years ago, as a young man in my 20s in evangelical churches, I noticed a pattern among evangelical Christian women. The same unrealistic and delusional criteria espoused by this 53 year old woman was practiced by many of these women. The better looking women would date and invaribly wed up with alpha degenerates and libertines, or “unbelievers”, outside the faith, while the other plain girls would hold out for what they perceived as the best deal. The ones who wed up with the alphas would generally leave the churches, only to return later divorced and with broods of children. Those who held out, ended up aging, and then were spinsters. As I went into my 30s, I saw a noticeable trend with singles groups at evangelical churches. You’d see 8-10 young men in their 20s-30s, mostly college educated and successful professional men, then you’d see 30-40 young women, again in their 20s-30s, mostly single unwed mothers or single mother divorcees with children, and a few single women. Most were average looking. The men wanted to wed up with godly women and procreate, but none wanted “the damaged goods”, and the few remaining single women felt they could hold out for the perfect Prince Charming the lord was going to mysteriously plop into their laps. The irony was the single women, like Wendy Griffith, aged out of the dating/mating pool, while the single mothers fell off the charts, or became fodder for liberal mainline Protestant churches. Some of the men eventually married (usually later in life to younger foreign brides) and had families, and some ended up, sadly, in the divorced realm, while others, like me, remained single. I’m glad the dating/women thing is in my rear view mirror. I really feel for young traditionalist, conservative, and Christian men who want to marry and procreate. The ugly head of popular culture, and feminism, is eroding evangelical Protestant churches.
[D: Welcome Tubalcain.]