3 Older women likewise are to be reverent in behavior, not slanderers or slaves to much wine. They are to teach what is good, 4 and so train the young women to love their husbands and children, 5 to be self-controlled, pure, working at home, kind, and submissive to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be reviled.
–Titus 2:3-5 (ESV)
In I Lived It, country singer Blake Shelton sings about a time so different younger listeners are likely to find it hard to fathom. One of the differences between now and our recent past is back then some older women were still policing modesty:
Granny said the dress that my sister wore to church wasn’t long enough
…[Chorus]
Oh, you think I’m talking crazyIn a different language you might not understand…
Today Granny would be guilty of the sin of body shaming if she said such a thing. As Sheila Gregoire explains:
What if setting a modesty dress code actually becomes a stumbling block for women because it weakens their faith?
Moreover, today Granny (Gregoire) is too busy policing other women making sure they aren’t committing the sin of body shaming (or the sin of being a doormat) to tell her granddaughter a dress is too short for church.
See Also:
Modesty was one of – perhaps the most important – keystone of the traditional gender structure. As Allan Bloom explains in “Closing of the American Mind.”
——-
Central to the feminist project is the suppression of modesty, in which the sexual revolution played a critical preparatory role …Modesty in the old dispensation was the female virtue, because it governed the powerful desire that related men to women, providing a gratification in harmony with the procreation and rearing of children, the risk and responsibility of which fell naturally — that is, biologically — on women.
…Female modesty extends sexual differentiation from the sexual act to the whole of life. It makes men and women always men and women. The consciousness of directedness toward one another, and its attractions and inhibitions, inform every common deed. As long as modesty operates, men and women together are never just lawyers or pilots together.
…Modesty is a constant reminder of their peculiar relatedness and its outer forms and inner sentiments, which impede the self’s free creation or capitalism’s technical division of labor. It is a voice constantly repeating that a man and a woman have a work to do together that is far different from that found in the marketplace, and of a far greater importance.
This is why modesty is the first sacrifice demanded by Socrates in Plato’s The Republic for the establishment of a city where women have the same education, live the same lives and do the same jobs as men. If the difference between men and women is not to determine their ends, if it is not to be more significant than the difference between bald men and men with hair, then they must strip and exercise naked together just as Greek men did.
With some qualifications, feminists praise this passage in Plato and look upon it as prescient, for it culminates in an absolute liberation of women from the subjection of marriage and childbearing and -rearing, which become no more important than any other necessary and momentary biological event. Socrates provides birth control, abortion and day-care centers, as well as marriages that last a day or a night and have as their only end the production of sound new citizens to replenish the city’s stock… Only then can women be thought to be naturally fit to do the same things as men.
Let’s cut through the bull#$%^ and get down to brass tacks here. No woman feels objectified and humiliated by being told to dress modestly. She does not feel reduced to being a piece of meat. She feels shamed from the implication–correctly–that her goal was to elicit sexual desire in (at least some/the right type of) men.
All roads lead to the second commandment here.
What if setting a modesty dress code actually becomes a stumbling block for women because it weakens their faith?
This sentence has emotional, not logical meaning.
Sheila is the AntiGrandma.
Il Deplore
She feels shamed from the implication–correctly–that her goal was to elicit sexual desire in (at least some/the right type of) men.
She also feels shamed that someone correctly figured out that her goal was to elicit sexual desire in bad boys and thugs.
She feels shamed that someone actually called her out on it and said “you’re acting like a slut”.
Women want to be sluts and act like sluts. They just don’t want to be called sluts, be accurately described as sluts, or be confronted on their sluttery. Nor do they want to be accurately told that their sluttery has consequences.
Leave it to Sheila to claim that a great quality like modesty is in fact a stumbling block to the person being told to be modest. I imagine she also believes promoting a lifestyle of healthy eating and exercise is a stumbling block to fat women cause it may cause them to fell shame in their slovenly habits.
Shame can be a very powerful motivator and certainly should have a place in correcting destructive behaviors. Removing the shameful aspect from bad behaviors will just cause more people to engage in that behavior openly. People should be ashamed to be obese. Women should be ashamed of being sluts. Men should be ashamed when they let their wives be the boss. couple should be ashamed when they get a baseless divorce.
Shame, it keeps behaviors in check.
If it is any consolation; I think Blake Shelton is secretly gay. Like Brad Paisely gay. Gwen Steffani is a publicity stunt/cover job.
Heck, why have any dress codes at all. Go to Church naked.
No male space escapes the male space hunters : https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2019/02/28/sport/missouri-female-football-player-scholarship-spt-trnd/index.html
Slightly OT.
https://meaww.com/meghan-markle-prince-harry-raise-upcoming-child-without-gender-stereotypes-gender-fluid-environment
A post from a previous article on this form stated, “Harry was dumpster diving in an American trash bin.” I guess we know who is wearing the pants in that relationship.
Why would it do such a thing? Why is telling someone to adhere to a standard going to cause them to stumble? What is the line of thought here?
It’s fine to shame men but not women? Do women get a pass but not the men? Why is it every time men get told to adhere to a some standard, no one cares but as soon as a standard is enforced for women, it’s oppression and will cause her to fail or ‘weaken her faith’. What an absurd statement.
And soon they will complain why men aren’t ‘men’ anymore. They cannot be this stupid.
If telling a Church going women to dress modestly causes her to stumble… I’m guessing that the lack of modesty was exactly the reason for her stumbling in the first place, not requiring her to dress properly.
Women know full well the attention they get from dressing a certain way. Enough of the bullshit. They know exactly what they are doing.
Wow…..another down-home country singer is gonna tell me about this kind of stuff while being twice divorced, and his escapades in the country music tabloids is noteworthy back in the early 2000’s….that thing with Gwen Stefani……ugh……but you know…..heck, he’s all about traditional values and being a “real man” but we don’t want to offend the ladies…..his biggest fan base……by not endorsing “anyone” for President
I’m surprised. Country music has a very creepy thing with worshipping women in their songs. See: Florida Georgia Line, “Holy” and the really bizarre Keith Urban song I think is titled “Female”?
Hello Jason, I hope you’re feeling better.
As to immodesty…. It is a naked assertion of female power. A young woman in immodest attire shows that neither her father nor church leadership can dictate her behavior. She shows that she has power over desirable men in the church when they validate her with attention and orbiting. She shows that she has power over undesirable men in the church when she can publicly shame them for looking at what she’s showing and have her white knights put them in their place. She shows that she has power over older women when she is the one receiving honor from the men, despite being childless and unmarried. She shows she has power over other young women when she receives the attention from the desirable men around her and they do not. It’s a power play, using sexual attraction, pure and simple.
I believe the Bible describes only two types of attire for women… modest attire, and the attire on a harlot (whore). Nothing counters female power like public humiliation; if a woman is going to dress as a whore and come to church it might be good to ask her, “Why are you coming here dressed as a whore?” After all, the entire circus she’s creating is predicated on no one calling her out. If your church is okay with women dressing as whores, including in the assembly, at least you’ll find out and can decide to move on… assuming they don’t move you on first.
For that matter, not all immodest apparel has to be the amount of skin shown. At a church I used to attend there was a teenage you woman whose parents paid for her to attend a fairly expensive, private, conservative christian high school. She would come to Wednesday night church services dressed in clothes which violated her school’s dress code; apparently she would go home and after school and change into clothes that she could not wear to school in order to come to church. A particular low light was a gaudy and garish t-shirt, which stated in less polite terms than I will use, that she was “dating the swim team.” (As an aside, her school did not actually have a swim team). No one ever confronted her on this or told her no. Eventually she got knocked up by some boyfriend of the other and moved into his trailer. But at least no one in church leadership caused her to stumble.
>Leave it to Sheila to claim that a great quality like modesty is in fact a stumbling block to the person being told to be modest. I imagine she also believes promoting a lifestyle of healthy eating and exercise is a stumbling block to fat women cause it may cause them to fell shame in their slovenly habits.
It’s partly a byproduct of the merging of Christianity with, oddly enough, free-market ideals. Moderns, and modern Christians as well, see Christianity as primarily being about marketing: how to win more believers, pack ’em in the pews, at any cost. If someone leaves the Church, it’s like a customer leaving your business – and it’s time for you to figure out what you did wrong, figure out what you have to do to win them back.
So you do your market research. What does your market say? They’re not a fan of that “modesty” stuff? Alright, back to the drawing board! How do we make this teaching palatable? Do we really NEED this ‘modesty’ teaching?
Etc, etc.
I once was having a conversation with someone about the Catholic church, and they were spelling out what the terms of their conversion would be. I forget what it was, but whatever they wanted, it violated a major teaching of the Church – so I said, well no, if you refuse to accept that, then you’d probably be a poor fit for the Church.
Immediately they started going off. “You lost me! Right there, you lost me! Do you understand that I would have gone to your church? But now to hell with it, I don’t want to, because you’re telling me I HAVE to believe something I reject? So you blew it. Good going!”
So I said… Frankly, I try to get people like you who are in the church already to either change your minds or leave. If that’s your belief, I’d rather you stay out altogether, thanks.
They were stunned. And I don’t think anyone ever told them before, “I’d rather you stay out of my church if that’s how you are.” To them it was incomprehensible. Christians are supposed to grasp for converts at all costs. To do anything they can to keep them in the pews, with the attitude of “Even if they don’t believe it all, maybe they’ll come around! If they leave, they may be lost forever!”
Other Christians get aghast at that, but if you look in the New Testament, ‘Turning away people’ is pretty common. It’s bizarre that modern Churches have trouble comprehending this. And it’s why you end up with women who see a teaching that people reject and treat it as a reason to ditch the teaching. Otherwise you’re telling a customer to leave your business, and what kind of business are you running here anyway?
@okrahead
The best way for this to happen is for an older female relative to do this privately, before it is public. The next line is for an older woman in the church community to take her aside and counsel her. And women have a way of saying these things such that a man listening wouldn’t even notice, but the conveyed message is unmistakable. There is practical brilliance to Titus 2 because older women can do this without seeming like bullies and can be brutally honest without causing the trauma the same brutal honesty would evoke if the message came from a man. The reality is that the older women in the church are policing the younger women anyway– always. It just comes down to what values the older women are policing. The Apostle Paul taught us that the older women should be policing the younger women towards being pure, and good and obedient wives and mothers (where applicable). That was by and large how it worked when Yiayia was the model. Now Sheila Gregoire and Mary Kassian are the models in conservative Christianity, and they are policing the women in the church to make sure they pass not God’s standards, but feminist standards.
Sadly, complementarian men are right there with Gregoire and Kassian, shaming women who exhibit excessive traditionalism in dress and custom. Thus you have the mocking of “prairie muffin jumpers” and the kind of woman who wears:
Yiayia would be mocked brutally for failing to have learned from the great enlightenment of the 1960s.
On the bright side all we really need is for Christian men, especially husbands/fathers/elders, to get the older Christian women in line and teaching according to Titus 2 instead of the Book of Oprah. And to do that, we just have to realize that chivalry isn’t Christian.
This is about fully enabling what Rollo Tomassi calls the “female imperative”. Women and girls want to dress in such a way to elicit desire in males they are attracted to, while at the same time condemning and shaming any other males who dare to notice how they are dressed.
What if not setting setting a modesty dress code becomes a stumbling block for women because it weakens their faith?
Since this thread is about Sheila Gregoire, it is time for some pics :
https://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/thumbnails/image/2013/09/04/13/Scary-Animal-Mouths-Pacu-Fi.jpg?w968h681
So I said… Frankly, I try to get people like you who are in the church already to either change your minds or leave. If that’s your belief, I’d rather you stay out altogether, thanks.
“I’d never join any club that would have me as a member.”
Sheila is the AntiGrandma.
Sheila is the Anti – a lot of things.
“Yiayia would be mocked brutally”
On the upside Yiayia wouldn’t care about the mockery, she knows she’s right and she knows they know she’s right.
“Pros. ti. tute!”
seventies Jason — ‘..heck, he’s all about traditional values and being a “real man” but we don’t want to offend the ladies…..his biggest fan base……’
Country music is dominated by Romanticism. The men tell themselves they are the last bastion of gender normalcy and manly society, but listen to the songs and lyrics. Moonie pedestal stuff. The badass cowboy culture is just as subjugated as prog-leftism. Just subjugated another way.
They imagine they’re hunkerin’ down as Brave Conservers, but all they’re conserving is moldy Cathari propaganda.
Idk how to put pictures on here, but there is a meme going around Facebook about how “your grandma wore miniskirts, listened to the Beatles, drove a Mustang GT, and was cooler than you’ll ever be”. Complete with pic of 70s girl in a miniskirt. Oookay….
My grandmothers are both still living, both age 93, one still lives alone. Neither one of them ever wore a miniskirt. One of them would tell me about how her mother hated the “flapper girls”. The other one lived wayyy out in the country, we would play, go swimming, garden, etc BUT once it was time to sit at the table for lunch/supper she would make all us girls wear shirts with sleeves. I am 30 years old and have never heard either one of them raise their voice or say a cuss word. Ever. Did I feel ashamed by being told to wear a shirt with sleeves, or the time Grandmother said I had too much lipstick on and we shouldn’t be vain? No. I admired and loved them and wanted to please them. I still don’t wear lipstick to this day unless very rarely for a special occasion. Both were homemakers and mothers of large families. My maternal grandmother didn’t even drive until after the death of my grandfather.
It’s sad tho that most don’t have such grandmothers, especially the people younger than me. My husband is older than me, and had his kids very young, so I actually have two little step-granddaughters. When I think of what my grandmothers mean to me, the shoes I have to fill, it is a very sobering thought.
Pingback: He lived it. | Reaction Times
@Ray
I can’t take credit for this, because someone pointed it out to me. But it isn’t surprising when you remember that cowboy culture is horse culture. They are the modern armed men on horseback, aka Lancelot.
Malcomthecynic
“She loves me like Jesus does”
“Cowboys and Angels”
“Man to man”
“She let herself go”
The list is endless
‘My Maria’ by Brooks and Dunn is a well crafted and executed song, with a soaring chorus line. Popular in its time and v catchy.
But it’s a paean to Mariolatry.
Puts the boy in cowboy, don’t it?
Modesty in general is a favorite topic of my wife and I. It’s not just what the person is wearing, but the deeper things going on. I can’t always tell what these are – I don’t even think most people themselves are usually even aware.
My wife is very “modest” and had to be encouraged to even dress feminine for me early in our marriage, she had a lot of shame and body image issues, like many teen girls. She is good at this now, dressing for me, but is always wondering what is “appropriate” to wear to my gigs, to church, in public. It’s actually a hard area for even well-meaning and godly women – to look nice without being a slut. To be godly and not a walking marshmellow.
On one hand you want to look nice, to make your spouse look good (and she does). I enjoy this, but there is certainly a line where you’re just attention whoring. I don’t really know what the line is, it seems like such a gray area.
Maybe a Dalrock series on this would be a good idea 🙂
Modesty in attire and behavior in women makes them attractive. So of course feminist Shelia and that ilk would say it is a ‘stumbling block’. Stumbling block to feminism…not Christianity.
But it isn’t surprising when you remember that cowboy culture is horse culture. They are the modern armed men on horseback, aka Lancelot.
These men tend to make outstanding friends, though you would be hard pressed to find a more dedicated white knight of the garter than your average semi-urban cowboy. They will yes ma’am a woman half their age and put aside whatever they were doing to chase “the lift”.
Men never have a problem with wardrobe malfunctions: funny that.
Times change: it would be unthinkable now but aged eighteen and fresh out of school I had my own long-legged mini-skirted shorthand-typist also eighteen years old. A young woman I liked more than I can express and of whom in the seven years I knew her I never heard one breath of scandal.
Modesty of heart might begin with a headcovering. Boy oh boy, now I’ve done it, some poor girl might have her faith weakend by the teaching the epistles.
I have to give Sheila credit.
I am constantly hammering her with Tweets that challenge her logic.
I’ve called her a heretic. I’ve been pretty relentless. And yet…
she has not blocked me.
I have never, once, had a single interaction with Tim Bayly. Yet when I went to look at his Twitter feed, he had already blocked me! He must have seen some challenging Tweets I did to the Warhornmedia feed.
So yes I get it, maybe Sheila allows me on her feed so that she can push back against a misogynist troll and look good to her followers. But give her some credit. She has the guts to leave my Tweets up and even engage, and she has done so numerous times with Rollo and I. I’m pretty sure she is sincere, but also misguided.
Sheila is somewhat anti-fragile, at least on Twitter.
I can’t say the same about Bayly.
@Ray
Well played.
There is surely an inverse rule that the less attractive the woman the more flesh will be on display. Can’t imagine the present FLOTUS being anything less than modest. What this thread needs is to hear from Yia-yia:
@ray:
‘My Maria’ by Brooks and Dunn is a well crafted and executed song, with a soaring chorus line. Popular in its time and v catchy.
But it’s a paean to Mariolatry.
I never heard the song, either by B&D or the original 70’s version by B. W. Stevenson, as referring to the Virgin Mary. But the Maria in the song is on a pedestal of sorts.
Can’t imagine the present FLOTUS being anything less than modest.
You can’t? Her nude pics are all over the internet from her young years.
@Novaseeker
I had no idea but then again I have never deliberately searched. Novaseeker Hmmm.
In the meanwhile and though I confess it is about as far off topic as can be I have been much saddened by the death of Andre Previn a great Pianist, Conductor and Composer and a man who was a great fan of matrimony. I link something which I assume American have never seen and which might thus greatly surprise – or is it that his profile was always higher in England where he achieved a superstar status than in America? Previn was, at the time of the clip, the Chief Conductor of the London Symphony Orchestra.
Sheilah Gregoire says:
“What if setting a modesty dress code actually becomes a stumbling block for women because it weakens their faith?”
Translation: “Requiring a woman to obey the rules of the Faith by making her follow God’s commandments to dress and act modestly means she can’t just pretend to be faithful anymore and has to actually walk the talk. That’s just MEAN!!!!”
Unbelievable that this woman is taken seriously by (supposed) adults and is actually PAID for the garbage she spews out.
Secular Blasphemy says:
March 1, 2019 at 2:03 pm
You 100 percent nailed it. As long as “church” is seen and treated as a business and (otherwise unemployable) church leaders have to rely on the contents of the collection plate (i.e., “paying customers”) for their daily bread, this is the inevitable outcome.
Every pastor has read the New Testament thoroughly enough to know that both Jesus and Paul were not shy about disciplining or even expelling people from the body who flouted God’s laws or who clearly showed themselves by their words and deeds to be false believers. Then again, they weren’t running a business, unlike the frauds pretending to preach today.
I just wanted to add something else about Previn: it seems to me that he follows in a line which ends with him and began with Gershwin to be followed and only by Bernstein. They were all of course Composer Conductor Pianists (as indeed are all but a few composers) but what makes them different is that not only were they from their teen years big names and seemingly without the usual conservatoire training but were equally successful in classical and popular music. It will be suggested that this has something to do with the fact of their being ((())) yet England also received a large influx of Jewish people at the turn of the Nineteenth Century and in the 1930s and yet there is no such equivalent amongst English Musicians. There have been successful songwriters in England who were Jewish such as Lionel Bart but his oeuvre is limited to songs and also successful composers of orchestral music – say Berthold Goldshmidt or Peter Frankl – but they were not popular songwriters. The closest to someone who combined Jazz with serious music that we have to any degree of success was Richard Rodney Bennett but he was not (coming from Broadstairs) Jewish.
I also feel sorry for Gershwin for everyone agrees that Porgy and Bess is a great opera yet it is virtually unperformable (as is Koanga) because it requires an all-black chorus and as Blacking-Up is for reasons I cannot understand not politically acceptable the wise thing is for any opera company to give it a pass. For reasons also beyond my comprehension this stricture does not apply to caucasian women of the chorus yellowing up for Butterfly. I am happy that I saw Previn conduct in London (and also Bernstein in Washington’s Mall – Gershwin was somewhat before my time).
women have sunken to such degeneracy, their only method of competition will soon resort to being tolerable as a person and not betraying and abusing men.
probably right around the time sexbots drive the price of female companionship to rock bottom.
Dalrock — “I can’t take credit for this, because someone pointed it out to me. But it isn’t surprising when you remember that cowboy culture is horse culture. They are the modern armed men on horseback, aka Lancelot.”
Yeah some crossover there. I’d say there’s an even closer correspondence between the Lance/horse/chivalry culture and the modern sub-culture of females with horses. I’ve noted over the years that girls or women with horses often are arrogant, snotty, and entitled. Bubble Babes. Dunno the exact dynamic mebbe traded males out for horsey with the big thang. Females often receive sexual gratification when riding horseback. The grrlls won’t be mentioning this tho.
Most modern cowboys don’t have horses, just hats. The elevation of a retro cowboy culture was popular in the Fifties during my childhood. In a sense, this was American masculinity’s last gasp, looking backwards toward a time when men COULD be men. Before the barbed-wire and the ‘civilizing’ of the West i.e., womanrule. (See John Gast, ‘American Progress’.) If you watch the Fifties/Sixties teevee programs they are quite cucky. Some cowboy films, however, managed to avoid this and make masculine statements.
My old buddy Genghis ‘Can-do’ Khan was a bigtime horser. Not too chivalrous methinks. Tho compared to Jesus, the guy was a commie.
Hmm — ‘I never heard the song, either by B&D or the original 70’s version by B. W. Stevenson, as referring to the Virgin Mary. But the Maria in the song is on a pedestal of sorts.’
It’s open to interpretation.
The cuck-factor pedestalizing isn’t arguable. The Mariolatry connect is.
My father grew up on a working, small dairy farm, and was a farm hand after he got out of the USAF in 1959…….in 1960 most and the last of the small “working family farms” in Upstate New York went bust…including his family…..fields were used only for hay making and sales…..not to support the farm…….he then went into journeyman school to become a carpenter. New York State btw still is one of the largest dairy prodcers in the country.
What gets me about “:country music” when I do listen to it today….”todays country”……….so many songs about “workin on the farm / ranch” or “owning a tractor” and of course, the real symbol of modern country manhood: A TRUCK……..more songs now about that than there were back in the 1950’s (Eddy Arnold and the crew). This is how naive I am…….I was shocked to learn that Shania Twain is a country singer. Really. She’s a country singer? Mmmmmmm, okay. When I think female country singers…Dolly Parton, Barbara Mandrell, Donna Fargo…..
Women and horses……..don’t get me started……..a few real cowboys still use horses for work, even in the great ag swath of central California. Most people who own horses today….its a hobby horse, and a expensive hobby too. That part of California where I lived for a decade……millionaires there are men who still have mud on their boots.
I have never been a fan of country music………not my think……but when I have listened…..trucks, tractors, workin-on-the-farm, drinkin’ and elevating women to “virginal country girl thing”
Ray Price is my fav “country pop” singer.
Also……where is country musics biggest market in sales??????????? The South? Texas? The midwest???? NOPE.
LA, California. Look it up!
What’s even more peculiar to me with many of “todays country stars” their “look” is mirroring more of what “Grunge” looked like in the early 1990’s…….and sadly that scene and sound is what is defined as the “1990’s” even though it was over by 1994
C’mon Dal, join the 21st century will ya?
http://prophecynewswatch.com/article.cfm?recent_news_id=3004&fbclid=IwAR0fFttqseNou8cOBEYHPEkUZfDPXxHKoyXXLtyW8mNLSjid4Reg3_a7b7A
Does this not put a point on what you describe about the modern church or what?
;(
My old pastor used to say; ‘If its not for sale, it shouldn’t be on display”. All the women dressed modestly in his church. That was back in the 80s.
DQ,
The number of women on dating sites showing lots of cleavage and such complaining about just getting hit up for sex is somewhat humorous as it exposes their lack of the ability to think.
BillyS says:
March 2, 2019 at 5:34 pm
Although I don’t bother with dating sites, I’m not surprised by your comments. These women are just seeking attention. My approach is to ignore them. I think Okrahaed’s comments @ March 1, 2019 at 1:29 pm were excellent.
There is a comment by a Christian woman at the 5:00 mark about wanting Christian men to step up and all the ones she met are effeminate. Lots of reasons behind this but interesting podcast.
https://www.rooshv.com/roosh-hour-34-man-up
Well…..I am sure Roosh will swoop in and save her from her distress…….being the masculine man that he is.
No one Blake Sheltons age “lived it.”
In the Johnny Cash biopic “walk the line” there is s scene when June Carter is confronted by a fan who lets her have it about her divorce.
The scene is meant to show us how evil and judgmental we used to be. How far we’ve come from those ugly days.
@ Scott
Have you ever watched the movie “Great Balls of Fire”? Jerry Lee Lewis married his 13-year-old cousin (his third wife) before his divorce from his second wife was final. The movie posits that fans learning about this scandal led to his decline in popularity, and presents that as evidence of the fans’ intolerance. That movie debuted in 1989.
Bonus: Lewis divorced his cousin 13 years later (at least she was only 26!), and was married a total of seven times.
Oscar-
Absolutely. Lewis was creepy.
And now, 50 years later Michael Jackson whose life was orders of magnitude more creepy has zero post mortem drop in popularity.
We have accomplished a total and complete turning of values upside down.
So when she starfishes, she’s essentially laying there watching him masturbate. Enormously humiliating, debasing, and degrading all around.
With quantum leaps being made in VR sex technology, it probably won’t matter for much longer. The message increasing numbers of human women will get from more men than ever before will be “I prefer passionate and exciting sex with digital images (and plastic and latex too, as an alternative) to sex with your bitchy, skanky, entitled twat.”
This is the ultimate insult to any self-respecting woman, but most will lack the self-awareness to see it as such.
@feeriker
You are making a classic mistake that nearly all men and women make in this generation
And that is the assumption that what your gender finds attractive is what the opposite gender finds attractive
Most men are disgusted with a woman who sleeps with other men. You are assuming, logically that women also are disgusted with men who sleep with lots of women
The reality is that a woman who sleeps with multiple partners cannot be trusted to only have the children of her husband. She will sleep around and she will create bastards. What’s more, the worse she is the more likely she will even have NO children with her “husband” and only with her adulterous partners
A man who has the attention and affection of multiple women is PRESELECTED. That means to a woman he is MORE attractive precisely because he is a ladykiller – he is IN DEMAND
The upshot of all this is that the women will just regard those men who use vr and sexbots as inferior. They will chase even harder for the upper 5% of males
Those males will have heaven on earth. All that bitchy entitlement? That’s for you, not for Chad Thunderclap. He gets all sorts of love , especially when he acts cruel
To her mind, she is EARNING the attentions of the best male. That is worth far far more than all the kindness and love a lesser male could give. The moment he used her as a toilet is the greatest and most treasured moment of her life.
To you that is inconceivable, bc you are wired to dominate. But she is wired to surrender. The greater the male, the greater the surrender, the greater the reward.
It is important to understand the biology so as to understand WHY modesty is critical and HOW modesty protects women. Understand who we are protecting them from: we are protecting women from THEMSELVES
“What if setting a modesty dress code actually becomes a stumbling block for women because it weakens their faith?” – Sheila Gregoire.
What?
IF someone’s faith is so fragile, that its going to get blown away with the first puff of a demand for behavioural change, then their faith is based on very poor foundations.
Faith is founded on historical fact: Jesus rose from the dead. The Romans couldn’t stop that from happening, Herod couldn’t hide it. The Jews of Acts didn’t even try disputing it, and it is categorically the one time God demonstrated His supernatural abilities above all else with a sign : An empty grave. The only empty grave in history.
Sheila is better off shutting up, submitting to her husband (that poor bastard Keith) and doing a course in Apologetics.
@Scott
”And now, 50 years later Michael Jackson whose life was orders of magnitude more creepy has zero post mortem drop in popularity. ”
The case of Michael Jackson:
Canadian Court Rules Parents Can’t Stop 14-Year-Old From Taking Trans Hormones: https://thefederalist.com/2019/03/01/canadian-court-rules-parents-cant-stop-14-year-old-taking-trans-hormones/
On Wednesday, the Supreme Court of British Columbia, Canada ordered that a 14-year-old girl receive testosterone injections without parental consent. The court also declared that if either of her parents referred to her using female pronouns or addressed her by her birth name, they would be considered guilty of family violence.
As previously reported, Maxine* was encouraged by her school counselor in BC’s Delta School District to identify as a boy while in seventh grade. When Maxine was 13 years old, Dr. Brenden Hursh and his colleagues at BC Children’s Hospital decided that Maxine should begin taking testosterone injections in order to develop a more masculine appearance.
Although Maxine’s mother was ultimately willing to support hormone injections, her father Clark* was concerned about the permanent ramifications of cross-sex hormones. Suspecting that his daughter’s mental health issues might be more the cause than the effect of her gender dysphoria, he ultimately decided that it would be better for her to wait until she was older before she embarked on any irreversible course of treatment.
At that point, Hursh informed Clark that he would begin testosterone injections on the basis of Maxine’s consent alone, claiming that he had a right to do so under the BC Infants Act. Clark promptly sought an injunction to prevent this. On Wednesday, however, a judge deemed Maxine “exclusively entitled to consent to medical treatment for gender dysphoria,” regardless of the opinions of either of her parents.
Further, the court stated that “Attempting to persuade [Maxine] to abandon treatment for gender dysphoria; addressing [Maxine] by his birth name; referring to [Maxine] as a girl or with female pronouns whether to him directly or to third parties; shall be considered to be family violence under s. 38 of the Family Law Act.”
Late Wednesday evening, Clark was strongly disappointed by the court’s ruling. “The government has taken over my parental rights,” he said, “They’re using [Maxine] like she’s a guinea pig in an experiment … Is BC Children’s Hospital going to be there in 5 years when she rejects [her male identity]? No they’re not. They don’t care. They want numbers.”
East Germany gave male hormones to their female athletes. The results after adulthood include:
Infertility,
Heart disease,
Depression,
Degenerative bone disease
How can any minor make these decisions for themselves? Why isn’t the state protecting them from these outcomes?
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/east-germanys-forgotten-olympic-doping-6949436
Doctors that perform transition therapy on minors will go down in history with those that performed lobotomies–as medical monsters.
No one Blake Sheltons age “lived it.”
He’s a scant few years behind you and I Scott, and I lived it. It was no joke in my family OR in my church.
I have never been to a church where the older women shamed the younger (single) women for dressing like whores. In fact, I have never been to a church with any young single women in it, period. The girls turn 18, head off to college, and never return to church.
Scott — ‘No one Blake Sheltons age “lived it.”’
Only a few. Who paid for their early wisdoms.
None of them decided to be mediocre celebrities.
That was good Ron. Chad Thunderclap should be registered.
Oh and he’s a vampire too. But the good kind.
So sad and true. The allure of the carousel is strong. Even an average looking girl will have guys lined up (provided she puts out). It’s easy to believe the universe revolves around you under those circumstances. One the they hit the Walll some come back, hoping to reel in a sucker.
The girls turn 18, head off to college, and never return to church.
They do, after they get married. This is an overall trend with the young, though. In the EO parish I attend, we have maybe 2-3 young single women and about the same number of young single men, but we always have a large number of parents with young families (this is DC, so that means people between 30-45 with kids under 10). On any given Sunday (like, say, today), you have about 50% of the people in attendance at the Divine Liturgy being like that (families with young kids), about 45% being married couples who have adult kids, and about 5% being unmarried singles. The unmarried singles just don’t come to church. Some of them (quite a few of them) come back once they get married, because they have kids and want to raise them with some religion, but almost all of these were not attending when they were young and single themselves, and you can easily see it by looking around the church any Sunday. Young single people just don’t go to church in anything approaching the numbers that married people do. In the United States, the church is perceived as being something married people do (I think this is the case in all churches — Protestant, Catholic, Orthodox … it’s an American thing).
“In fact, I have never been to a church with any young single women in it, period.”
The other day, my priest told me it shouldn’t be that hard to get married if I wanted to. I replied I hadn’t noticed any single ladies warming the pews on Sunday, and his response was: “well, maybe you could try meeting women at the grocery store.” I’m not kidding.
@Thursday:
That’s an excellent example of the obtuse pastoral cluelessness that is prevalent in most denominations today. It’s a pretty even mixture of head-in-the-sand willful ignorance and rectal-cranial inversion stupidity. It certainly explains the current state of decay.
Thursday,
“well, maybe you could try meeting women at the grocery store.” I’m not kidding.
Under daygame principles, that isn’t bad advice.
Of course, the priest is a pedestalizer, and assumes that this should lead to buying dinner for her for months while ‘courting’ her, when in reality, 3-6 hours of 1:1 time and minimal expense is all that is needed to get to sex, even from a daygame approach at the grocery store.
I wonder what your priest would say about a man who is an expert at opening women at the grocery store, to such an extent that he has bedded over 20 of them. He is technically following the priest’s advice. The priest is clueless about the fact that a man is not going to be good at opening women at the grocery store unless he practices doing this dozens if not hundreds of times, which by definition means he will have had to have had sex with several of them.
The notion that a priest thinks opening women at a grocery store gels with the paradigm of ‘courting’ her for months or years, is astonishing. What does he think the N count of the women at the grocery store is?
Exactly. Laws affect immediate supply, but it cant reduce a desire or the supply in the long term.
However, shame can affect demand. As a result it can also reduce supply.
This applies to: sexual promiscuity, abortions, simps, etc.
The notion that a priest thinks opening women at a grocery store gels with the paradigm of ‘courting’ her for months or years, is astonishing.
The notion probably comes from romcoms. Many romcoms have a “meet cute.” An unexpected cute meeting between two people destined to fall in love, because they’re soul mates.
Romcoms promote the notion that if you just wander about life, in grocery stores or wherever, you will eventually bump into your soul mate. There will be instant recognition via the “meet cute,” followed by (after a few funny mishaps and misunderstandings) a lifetime of travel, adventure, romance, and fireworks.
Your priest is suggesting that the grocery store might provide good opportunities for a “meet cute.”
“well, maybe you could try meeting women at the grocery store.” I’m not kidding.
Question : In the interest of fairness, is the Priest married? Or is this a Catholic Priest who takes a vow to never marry?
If the Priest is not married and never was, then I cut him some slack. While he is ill-equipped to give the advice required of his position, and lacks the curiosity to figure out while his own pews have no single women, there is little to no chance he could possibly parse the difference between the MMP of 1950 vs. 1990 vs. today. Even worse, he has no real-world basis to figure out that a RomCom is not real (as per RPL’s point).
But if he is married, then his advice is astonishingly bad and reveals a lot about him (none of it good).
Dalrock, inknow how you like fake feminists heroes like the factory woman or Amelia Erhard, but I have something among the kind:
Not woman as good as men, but women almost as good as men:
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/8543575/woman-soldier-almost-becomes-first-female-para/
I always thought, not that I have ever attempted it, that opening to a woman in a public library was a good idea. Unlike a grocery store where she is attempting to get out as soon as may be she will be relaxed, thumbing through some book – and you likewise, so you will have much plausible deniability – and so you lean across to her with the words ‘you know, actually, that is really not a very good book’. Does not matter what the book is indeed the better or more famous the book the better the opening – she will be keen to learn why you think the less of Wuthering Heights or War and Peace. You can make it up on the spur of the moment.
Meeting people can be done either in a working situation, or in a social one. I have however had frequent success whilst traveling; at a bus-stop, on a cross-channel ferry, at a railway station but best of all just speaking to someone waiting at a Zebra-crossing or even just walking along in the countryside (although I know that is not done in America). ‘I live just there’ you say to the girl at the zebra. ‘Come visit me some time’ – and she did – two days later.
I once was romantically linked to a news-anchor female “‘This is Jane Doe standing outside the Houses of Parliament and now back to the studio”. She had a bad case of non-stop talking as if silence would reveal her vacuity and she unable to prevent herself from spewing out everything she had learned at Oxbridge – and so our ways parted. Later whilst she was covering some strike she was knocked over by the rioting crowd. When she came too she found herself looking into the eyes of one of the photographers who had come to her rescue. Reader, she married him which shows that RomComs are entirely and much to your surprise entirely realistic and I say good luck to the photographer for he will need it.
this is such beautiful music. I didn’t know your people had such beauty to share. thank you.
RPL-
The entire lyrics to the Waitresses song “Christmas Rappring” is a meet cute.
I believed it was possible and would happen exactly like that (running into my soul mate in an unlikely mundane scenario) and this would be the story we would tell everyone later.
But if he is married, then his advice is astonishingly bad and reveals a lot about him (none of it good).
We have married priests in the Orthodox Church, but they often don’t met their wives in normal ways. They have to be married before they are ordained, and at that point they are in the seminary so they aren’t going out 3-5 nights a week with a wing, opening sets, and so on. Mostly their mate market is made for them by women who seek out seminarians to marry them — many of these women are either the daughters of priests themselves, or extended family of priests (nieces, cousins). Sometimes another woman who is not herself related will get an “introduction” to a seminarian through the priest network (which, in Orthodoxy, since most of our priests are married, is a closed network of people whom the families are trying to marry off into other priest families typically). There are exceptions to this, where the seminarian will have met the woman before he entered the seminary, in which case it’s more in the “normal” way, but it’s often the case that they meet their wives while they are at the seminary. In any case the church itself takes an interest in this because they normally prefer that the candidate for ordination not delay being ordained because he hasn’t found a wife yet, so the priests who are running the seminaries (most of whom are married themselves) take an interest in trying to help seminarians who are looking for wives find a woman who wants to marry a priest.
So, basically, most of them don’t have much of a clue about how to find a mate normally, either. They understand relationship stuff much better than celibate priests do, for obvious reasons, but often they don’t understand that much about how to go about finding a mate in the secular world, whether 1950s or 2020s.
Opus,
The Public Library would be a good place in theory, but few still go there so it is quite unlikely now. The same would be true about bookstores, since they are on the way down too.
The risk of a very SJW woman at either place is quite high as well, unfortunately.
Though, in all fairness Opus. Wuthering Heights really is, not a very good book…
It really is a portrayal of the worst forms of drama, the long drawn out saga of two unhappy and miserable people who pretend they cannot live without each other but rather want the drama than to actually be together and so marry other people. It really does play to the worst parts of the female hind brain. What I mean by that is the on going problem of women wanting the feeling of wanting someone but never actually wanting to commit to that person for fear of being either poor, low status or eventually bored. No sacrifice should be needed for love to be worthwhile after all.
No happy ending.. so there’s that at least. Nothing like a uplifting ending of lovers lost. Gets me every time.
Real life “romantic comedy behavior” puts real life men in jail, or labeled a “creep”
It only works if……….you guessed it….you as a man have to “lloks” to back it up
Well…..maybe I’ll have some luck at the Rod Stewart concert. I will be seeing ol “Rod the Mod” at Bolton University near Manchester UK on June 14th 2019. I bought my ticket last night. Spent a kings ransom for a center front seat. I’ve always been a “Faces” “Shotgun Express” and “Steampacket” fan from his early days….and his work from the 1970’s…….what can anyone say? Top face stuff. Women love this guy for some strange reason.
While in London, tickets at a small, intimate lounge to see British “Burt-Bacharach-fans -extrodinaire” one of my fav bands from high school and college…..”Swing Out Sister” ………I saw them perform at my college in Vermont back in 1990. At this show I am going to get a picture with Andrew. He blew me off in 1990. From the mid nineties….
@feministhater
You catch on fast.
‘What’ I interject’ not a good book and why Sir not?’
To which you reply ‘ this is 2019 so how can one approve of locking ones own wife in the attic even if she deserves it – but I don’t want to give away the plot’
‘He does that?’ she responds eagerly anticipating more plot revelations.
‘Not only locks her in but does so, so as to seduce the maid newly arrived from the country’. At this she is puzzled as although this would indeed be very bad this is exactly what she wants to read about. You say that you don’t want to give away the ending. It is at this point you have to determine whether she needs more negging or more encouragement. For dramatic effect you lower your voice and say “this is a library so I really do not want to speak out loud’ Soon she will be encouraging you to invite her to Starbucks for a coffee. Not a good idea as the place is far too noisy. Keep in the library pinned in the corner between the mass of lowering novels eagerly catching every last word. Take out a novel as a prop and twirl it around as if when it comes to books and much else you are the master. After that you are on your own but I don’t think you are going to have much trouble.
Billy S: The Public Library would be a good place in theory, but few still go there so it is quite unlikely now. … The risk of a very SJW woman at either place is quite high as well
The libraries here in the Los Angeles area are aka Homeless Central. Library bathrooms are where many of our homeless go to bathe. The homeless are also known to enjoy watching pron on the library internet.
Then, of course, there are the various SJW programs, such as Trannies Reading to Children and Racial Justice Discussion Panels for Black History Month.
Lol! I’m sure they’ll be like putty in my hands..
You must understand, of course, that the only ladies that tend to read in the libraries these days tend to have ages north of 50.. not the best crop from which to harvest.
Actually, many libraries now have free WiFi and an espresso vendor in the lobby. I have seen a few younger women at the local library. Whether they are worth chatting up is another matter altogether (the Magic 8 Balls says “Don’t count on it”)
Library here in Santa Rosa. Homeless emcampment during the day. Patrons are older (my age and up) women with stringy gray hair, birkenstocks, and angry, angry, angry that “Trump” is president because if he had his way “all libraries would be closed”
Female library workers are a younger version of these women.
We have “gay and lesbian” storytime here and all other actvities at the library are always of an “activist” bent / slant.
The library here was donated by Charles Schulz (in 1974) and its actually a well designed building and nice library. I wanted a book by David Horoitz and they didn’t have it……but they have a whole section dedicated to “cats” and the amazing things that they do