In his post The Left pushes America down a slippery slope Larry Kummer contemplates the implications of the latest round of the culture wars with the inclusion of a “transgender woman” in the current Miss Universe contest:
If he – or she, as you prefer – wins, it will be a milestone. That is, a meaningless even by itself but marking progress on a path going somewhere. We can see only a few of the implications.
- As the guys at 4Chan said long ago, this shows that men are better at everything than women – including being women.
- It shows the glitterati is hard-left, contemptuously poking in the eye their mostly traditional and mostly male audience.
- It shows that the far Left is winning, remaking our society in a form more pleasing to their ideology. Almost uncontested.
- It means the West is going full Weimar. That didn’t end well last time.
- It probably means other things. Things of great significance but beyond my pay grade to see.
I’ll add a speculation of my own to the list. I suspect that as men dressing as women becomes more and more common, we are going to see women start to fear being mistaken for men. For many decades the trend has been for women to ape men, starting at least in the 1920s with Amelia Earhart and her peers. This has progressed so far that today we have two kinds of clothing and styles:
- Clothing and styles everyone can wear.
- Clothing and styles men must not wear.
For a woman to be seen as “crossdressing” she has to not only put on the apparrel and hairstyle of a man, but she has to make a concerted effort to pass herself off as a man. This isn’t true for men. If we see a dude with a full beard but with a woman’s haircut and wearing a dress, we still recognize this as crossdressing. We would in fact recognize it instantly if he were merely wearing women’s shoes. But a woman not wearing any women’s clothing (there is no longer men’s clothing) with a butch haircut isn’t seen as crossdressing unless she goes by a man’s name and speaks with a false deep voice. It is possible for a woman to crossdress in our society, but it takes extreme effort.
Yet as men are pushing the envelope from the other direction this creates an entirely new problem for feminists. While they want to be like men, they don’t want to be mistaken for a man, or at least for a transvestite. They may applaud Jenner, but they don’t want to be mistaken for him. Making this all the worse is that transvestites very often do want to be mistaken for women. This can create very uncomfortable situations for women who just a few years ago would have been seen as having great moxy; now they aren’t seen as women dabbling at being men but the reverse!
For an admittedly extreme example of this, see the NY Post story Grandma sent to all-male jail after mistaken for transgender man. In that case, a woman who doesn’t look that out of the ordinary was mistaken for a transvestite. She does have a very manish expression about her, but this is commonplace for women in this age. Tragically her jailers refused to believe her when she assured them she was a woman, and she spent a harrowing 10 hours locked up in a holding cell with 40 men.
When a corrections officer asked the nurse if she had physically examined de Veloz, she brushed her off, firing back, “She’s a man” — and then walked away, the Miami Herald reported.
…
“You are a woman. Good luck if you’re alive tomorrow,” a corrections officer told her, according to the suit.
It may seem obvious that the nurse should have physically checked to see what kind of bits de Veloz has, but we live in a complicated world. While de Veloz is suing her jailers for not checking her bits, The NY Post has another story about an inmate suing jailers for doing just that: Transgender woman forced to show genitals in jail, called a ‘he-she’: suit
A transgender woman in Texas was forced to show her genitalia to jailers who questioned her sex in Dallas County after she was arrested on a weapons charge, an explosive lawsuit claims.
…
“Ms. Jackson has suffered trauma, felt demoralized, anxious, stressed, a loss of dignity, and fear,” the lawsuit states, adding that county officials violated the federal Prison Rape Elimination Act, which prohibits jails from examining transgender or intersex detainees solely to determine their gender.
But it isn’t just jailers who face confusion on the issue. As crossdressing becomes more and more accepted, even promoted, we will all face this quandary. After all, if you looked at both women in the respective news stories (here and here), the man dressing like a woman looks more feminine than the manish woman.
I suspect that just as we have seen men responding to women trying to look like men by growing beards and lifting weights, we are likely to see women’s fashions similarly react to men encroaching on women’s territory. If I’m right, this won’t just show up as a resurgent appreciation for skirts, dresses, and non-sensible shoes. I suspect this will show up in women’s facial expressions as well. Today nearly all women are terrified of presenting a quiet, gentle spirit. But as men continue to get better at looking like women, women are going to find themselves more and more afraid of being mistaken for men.
“I suspect that just as we have seen men responding to women trying to look like men by growing beards and lifting weights, we are likely to see women’s fashions similarly react to men encroaching on women’s territory.”
What we’re going to see is the debate go even further into absurdity and even deeper confusion for both men and women over how they are supposed to behave.
For all his faults, Milo correctly observed that straight men and women have more or less checked out of the gender wars and left it to circus freaks like him and feminists to duke it out over what is considered appropriate behavior for men and women.
And as a aside, take everything that hacks like Chandler are saying about gays and copy and paste that excerpt with trans, because that will be the next step for them; pressuring straight men and women in the church to date and marry trans men and women.
Watching the fight for hierarchy on the “I’m special!” social ladder in the U.S. is as entertaining as it is sickening. From what I can gather in limited Flyoverville, the lowest rung is firmly occupied by white male veterans with VA disability ratings.
Did that woman not have a Dominican passport that identified her as a woman? Or did that get blown off?
Also, what was amusing was that she was arrested upon arrival in Miami on some old drug charges.
Anywho, I seem to recall that there used to be a simple test that only required saliva to determine what kind of chromosomes one has, and that it was used in women’s sports to keep men out. I don’t see why the justice system couldn’t use that test. Of course, that’s being logical and reasonable, which makes you Hitler or something like that these days.
Women will have a hard time at that, I think, because the more effeminate transwomen tend to dress very exaggeratedly feminine and have very low body fat. If they are petite for men (5’6 or shorter), they can give women a very hard time, I think, particularly given how obese many women are. I mean anyone who knows what to look for can still tell it’s a transwoman, but lots don’t know and if the guy is short enough and slender enough (i.e., effeminate by nature anyway), it’s much more of a toss up than the Amazon one in Larry’s post.
@Novaseeker
I think that part is more what is a problem for men, the risk of mistaking another man for a woman. The problem for women is the risk of being mistaken for a man. The two are obviously related. But for women until now they could masculinize themselves with impunity. This was an overt goal of feminism. But unspoken was the expectation that they wouldn’t be mistaken for a man.
Even if a woman isn’t actually mistaken for a man, I think we will see other women making the accusation in catty (if deniable) ways. I think the line of what is acceptable will move a bit back.
This article supports my prediction that in just a few short years, cuckservative pastorbators will loudly proclaim how much they support traditional marriage by pressuring straight men to marry ‘women’ who are MtF transgenders. If the person identifies as a ‘woman’, that will soon be good enough for cuckservatives to virtue-signal about their pro-marriage activism off of.
All the elements are in place. The cuckservative trendline is going to reach this stage pretty soon.
The Question :
because that will be the next step for them; pressuring straight men and women in the church to date and marry trans men and women.
Yep, except only straight XY men will be thusly pressured. If there is one thing cuckservatives will never, ever do, it is to pressure an XX female into anything they don’t want to do.
But yes, a straight XY man will be pressured into marrying an MtF trans. In fact, cuckservatives will be extremely gleeful about using such situations to proclaim how much they favor traditional marriage.
@Anon
I’d like to scoff at this, but I’ve been stunned at how deep the trans acceptance trend has infected very orthodox men. Even men who wouldn’t be surprised if you said you oppose women’s suffrage are very sympathetic to the trans movement.
The only real answer is to completely disregard sex/gender, and house everyone together.
You want real equality, that’s what it looks like.
Dalrock,
I’d like to scoff at this, but I’ve been stunned at how deep the trans acceptance trend has infected very orthodox men.
Indeed. I would not have thought this was possible until about a month ago, but now all the trends seem to indicate what looms on the horizon.
I mean, if ‘Christian’ pastors are directing parents to let gays have access to their minor children (despite the centuries-established reality of *some* correlation between homosexuality and pedophilia), then it seems that pressuring men to marry MtF ‘women’ is hardly a stretch for the same pastors.
I don’t think there will be enough trans women to have an effect on dress but I do think there is an effect from Asian women that are like all women in the US were 60 years ago. The young Asian women where I work are thin, wear feminine clothing and aren’t loud. This is in contrast to the young white/black women who are overweight and look and act like construction workers. And Asian women are the most desired in online dating. Not surprising.
Dlarock: “While they want to be like men, they don’t want to be mistaken for a man, or at least for a transvestite …”
For the first time I disagree with Dalrock. As The Question says, “straight men and women have more or less checked out of the gender wars.”
I’ve lived for 30 years in the San Francisco Bay Area. I have spent long hours talking with young men on the front lines (men two generations younger than I).
The women that can easily be mistaken for men are dropouts from the gender war. If mistaken for men, they don’t care. They don’t dress for men, or do their hair, or wear make-up. Most have deferred that to the later day when their “careers” are established and they get a nice guy to start a family.
Sidenote: My wife predicts that these girls will find it difficult to master at 28 girl-skills that previous generations of girls began practicing at 12. Whereas modern girls get the most applause for acting like boys. Today I saw an poster of a college cheer-leading team (all girls) with the slogan “Are you touch enough?”
Alwo, cross-dressing guys are becoming as common as dirt. Being guys, they know how to act as guys want girls to act. They’re often difficult to detect, esp when wearing beer-goggles. For good reason they’re called “traps.”
https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Trap
This is the essence of the gender wars: too weird for words. People that haven’t been on the front lines can’t imagine what it is like there. The stories sound to me like science fiction about some future dystopia. San Francisco is the future, from which the tear in our society rips wider at an accelerating rate. This is Weimerica.
Why not seek your answer at Thailand? Trans women ladyboys are quite easy to tell with low voices, exaggerated hair and makeup, and clothing styles. Most women can’t afford to look like sluts. Many transgenders are actually prostitutes. Real women are shorter, thinner with more curves, high voices, and thinner hair. Women won’t care to compete. The actual competition is other women for men’s attention, but the train already left the station on this issue. Men aren’t attracted to transgenders and Bruce Gender still dates women. As for the beauty contests, let’s just bury the relic. Viewers will increasingly turn the show off especially with no more swimsuits. We won’t be seeing the bulge.
On the traps question, you now can observe young guys (18-25 to even 30) who have “had sex” with traps. They are also asking other guys “hey, uh….does that make me gay?”.
And then the rationalizations and logical IF-THEN responses include:
“It depends, when did you realize he was a trap?”
“Once you found out he was a trap, did you keep going?”
“If you kept going, yeah bro, you are probably as gay as a picnic basket.”
“If you stopped, or if other coitus interruptus, then no you’re probably not gay.
Another universe from just 10 to 15 years ago. Weird is the new “normal”.
Yeah, I agree with the assertion that what is happening on the “front lines” with the normalization of homosexuality and bi-sexuality, and the new religion of intersectionalism, giving rise to sexual nomenclatures like “feminine-presenting-transgendered-gay” are changing the pieces and moves on the sexual marketplace chessboard. Lots o confusion.
Meanwhile, always check “her” hands and “her” Adam’s apple, fellas.
Dead give aways.
Reliable, dead freaking giveaways.
@Anon
I remember debating this with you a couple weeks back, and I still think there’s enough of an “ick” factor to prevent churchian pastors from urging men to marry MtF trans. Also the trans movement, while showing impressive strength, doesn’t have the same might of the Feminine Imperative behind it (which has underpinned the movement for “man up and marry that slut”).
The “ick” factor is real. In looking at the two examples Dalrock linked, it was instantly apparent to me which was actually male. The masculine woman, while sporting an unfeminine scowl, looked surprisingly similar to both Nancy Pelosi and Kamala Harris, who are both unmistakeably women despite their disagreeable politics. The feminine man did admittedly have a much more feminine expression and composure. However, something about his face just didn’t seem right for a woman–perhaps it was the jaw, eyebrows, or nose. And since it was just a headshot, we didn’t even see the shoulders–which are often the biggest giveaway.
Badman,
I remember debating this with you a couple weeks back, and I still think there’s enough of an “ick” factor to prevent churchian pastors from urging men to marry MtF trans.
Yes. PuffyJacket had very good points too.
I thought about it, and still think that this is squarely within the trends that we see cuckservative pastors progressing along. See Dalrock’s comment above about how sympathetic erstwhile stalwarts are to it.
Plus, if pastorbators can pressure parents to allow gays to have access to their children (the ick factor + fear factor is much higher here, yet somehow not enough to deter this), then abusing men about not being willing to marry ‘women’ with XY chromosomes is in fact less of a reach…
Some will probably realize they must look more feminine, some will realize they only need to look more feminine than the dude with the beard.
The 4Chan guys got it right: Men are better at everything, including being women.
We will now have a mess at the Olympics, as the trannies will dominate every woman’s sport. That will make it not worth watching. The UFC will have to accommodate more Fallon Fox-es, making more men win and endangering XX women in the process.
Now, Miss Universe will have to accommodate the same mental illness, making it unwatchable. One looks at Beauty pageants to look at beauty, the domain of women, not a freak show.
I imagine that a stop to the madness will occur when the elites will look at the revenues of their various enterprises – Miss Universe, the Olympics, even regular businesses, and find that they no longer make money because they don’t actually make anything, having long been relegated to repositories of freakdom because Affirmative Action has forced them to employ non-productive weirdos.
“I imagine that a stop to the madness will occur when the elites will look at the revenues of their various enterprises – Miss Universe, the Olympics, even regular businesses, and find that they no longer make money …”
No, it won’t stop there. It’s about power, not money. They want the power to make you say their perversions are good and righteous.
What’s strange is that the more women look like men the more I hear men complain women don’t look “real” enough. It’s like they want them to look more masculine than they do already. I don’t get it.
Pingback: Will trans acceptance push women to look more feminine? | Reaction Times
Agreed. It explains why Hollyweird is willing to produce so many flops that lose money. It’s about propaganda and agenda.
It remains to be seen how successful they will be with that. That said, I do expect these pastorbators to push marrying a tranny in a few more years,
@Novaseeker
” anyone who knows what to look for can still tell it’s a transwoman, but lots don’t know”
There’s a bit of wink, nod, nudge, nudge, secret handshake BS going on there.
I almost think you secretly want men to mistake trans for the real thing. You purposely obscure identifying and tell-tale signs a tranny is really a man. Is it Adams Apple? Big man-hands? What else is there? Attitude? Gait? I have seen many solders and sailors fooled by trannies. What’s the secret method you’re hiding?
Straights may have not be interested in gender war. But the gender war is interested in them. The fact that the Duluth model exists for Law is evidence alone of that fact.
@Anon
Wouldnt be surprised if pastorbators are compromised sodomites themselves either.
So here is a thought question: If a transvestite walks into a typical churchian gathering today, wearing a feminine head covering, how do the churchians react?
Do they object because he, pretending to be a woman, is wearing a symbol of female submission, and no goddess should have to submit to a man, not even symbolically?
Do they let Him wear it, and say nothing, because we all know it is traditional for women to wear head coverings in church, and so it goes with the rest of the costume’s intention towards giving off the image of him being a female?
Do they go Sharkly on the dude and inform him that it is a shame for a man, in God’s image, to pray with his head covered like a woman?
Do they compliment his head covering and try to make him feel welcomed?
Do they try to explain that their church doesn’t follow 1 Corinthians 11:1-10, and give him their excuses?
What would they do? Would they ask the other men to start wearing the symbol of submission in solidarity? Or will they get around to asking men to wear this symbol of submission in the near future?
What I find truly disturbing is the whole “chick with dicks” subculture, where men are actually looking for them. Will the church:
a. classify them as homosexuals?
b. classify them as healthy man-woman relationships?
@Novaseeker I mean anyone who knows what to look for can still tell it’s a transwoman
Which of these two is the transwoman?
they both are
I have over the years come into contact with a number of cross-dressers. Up close there is no mistaking their being male. They just do NOT have the scent of a woman. Never come across the reverse although we had a local councilor who had been born female but now had a beard: no mistaking that either despite the beard as she/he was only about five foot tall. Never been to Thailand.
Straights may have not be interested in gender war. But the gender war is interested in them. The fact that the Duluth model exists for Law is evidence alone of that fact.
Leftism is a religion that is determined to bring everyone in society under its authority. One of the mistakes that religious people make is to think that if they don’t bother the leftists, the leftists won’t bother them.
@Dave One of the mistakes that religious people make is to think that if they don’t bother the leftists, the leftists won’t bother them.
And I would add: “if we don’t bother the muslims, the muslims won’t bother us”
Gents,
You’re trying (and failing) to look into the future, when you should be looking to the past. Western culture has been here before. In fact, it started here.
Ask yourselves; what do the sexual habits of ancient Rome and Greece tell us?
Additionally, what do cultures that have similar sexual habits today tell us (i.e., Afghanistan)?
We can only wish. Somehow, i don’t think we will be so lucky as to see transgender-ism cause the female style pendulum to swing toward the feminine.
“I have seen many solders and sailors fooled by trannies. What’s the secret method …”
Stay sober and keep your pants zipped?
You purposely obscure identifying and tell-tale signs a tranny is really a man. Is it Adams Apple? Big man-hands? What else is there? Attitude? Gait? I have seen many solders and sailors fooled by trannies. What’s the secret method you’re hiding?
In almost all cases it isn’t hard to tell if you actually are looking for it. The key is always comparing to genetic women — some trans may look like women in isolation, but if there are genetic women around, you can compare easily enough. Some telltales are:
– Height. If the guy is average height or taller for a male, he will look much taller than most of the girls in the room especially if he is wearing high heels (which almost all trans do). The biggest “problem” most guys who would-be trans face is that they are average or taller in male height, which makes them look like Amazons among women, and standing out as a trans is the kiss of death (if they stand out from genetic women, they are more easily “read” as not being genetic women).
-Hands and feet. They are much larger than genetic women’s hands and feet in 99.5% of cases. It’s very easy to compare to a genetic woman’s hands or feet if you are in a room full of genetic women and there is a trans there. Even men with small hands, for men, have significantly larger hands than almost all women.
-Head and shoulders. The head size is bigger than a woman’s, and it’s usually quite noticeable if there are genetic women around. Also the shoulders are wider than most women’s (yes there are girls with wide shoulders so this is less “foolproof” but normally those are quite large girls overall … whereas almost all men regardless of height or size have wide shoulders).
-Hip flare. All genetic women, even very skinny ones, have a pronounced hip flare that men do not have, regardless of how fat they are. If the trans is “advanced”, there may have been surgical implants to create the illusion of a hipflare, so this isn’t foolproof, but the lack of any hipflare is a strong trans tell.
-Flat butts. Women and men have different butts. Even a very thin woman has a more rounded butt than a man does. This isn’t always that easy to see, however, if the person is wearing a skirt or dress, so not the first thing to look for.
-Greater angularity, less body fat. Even slim, slender, skinny women have significant softness due to higher body fat than men do. Trans often have figures that can appear slender and feminine at first glance but that actually, when compared with slender genetic women, are too skinny, as in not enough softness. There is more angularity, and more firmness but less softness. This can be harder to tell in isolation but shouldn’t be hard to tell if they are standing next to a genetic woman.
-Adam’s apple/brow/chin — these are less reliable because trans can, and often do, have these “shaved down” surgically to either more or less disappear (Adam’s apple) or be less prominent (brow and chin), but if you do see a “girl” with an adam’s apple, it’s a trans.
Are there exceptions? Yes, there are. You could be dealing with a guy who would, if he were presenting as a guy, look freakishly small and petite — say he’s 5’3 or 5’4, very slim, narrow boned and shouldered and so on. He probably can “fool” quite a few people. But he’s also really rare, and most trans are not guys who are 5’4, because there just aren’t many guys like that, period.
As for why guys get fooled by trans, there are quite a few reasons, I think. The key for a trans is not to raise someone’s dander, so if they can pass a baseline “M or F” test, the person looking at them usually won’t scrutinize them, so the guy isn’t going to be looking at how large her hands are and so on because she passes the initial “M or F” identifier in his head, and so he isn’t scrutinizing her. This is more likely to happen (1) the shorter the trans is relative to local male average height, and (2) the more work the trans has had done (face work, hip flare implants, adam’s apple removal etc). Beer goggles and social lubrication play a role, as does the actual ability of the trans to project a feminine vibe (how they move, how they speak, how they gesticulate and so on). Another factor is ethnicity — because of average height differences between races, it seems like there are more “passable” trans in the context of North America and Europe who are Asian or Latino, because these men are more often smaller, on average, in height and build than the typical American or European. They still stick out as trans in the home cultures, because there the comparison is different, whereas here they are often notably smaller and more petite than average men, and so can “pass” more easily as women in this culture than they actually can in their home cultures. Again, the key is whether they are being scrutinized and compared to genetic women around them — if they are not, and they kind of pass the initial “M or F” discernment, then a guy can be fooled — he simply isn’t looking for the tells.
None of this means to be paranoid. What it does mean, though, is that if you are in a setting where there may be some trans around (say an urban setting or a more edgy one), you may want to take a closer look at that tallish blonde “girl” with really nice slender legs to see how “she” really looks when compared to the genetic women around “her”.
Which of these two is the transwoman?
I actually thought the second one looked pretty trans when you look at theother photos, especially in the face — certain camera angles are preferred for obvious reasons, but when you get a look at the face from other angles it looks much less feminine. Also I don’t see any pictures of that person standing with a group of genetic women, so I can’t get a sense of the height differential. No question that person would likely be harder to pick out — some create a much better illusion than others. It’s also the case, though, that 99% of trans don’t look like that person.
@Novaseeker
The second transwoman is working as a (female) model, and has somewhat of a celebrity status.
Here’s another example of “Loiza” from the instagram feed: https://www.instagram.com/p/Bfpx6obnVo8/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
There you can see a side by side (which almost of the other photos avoid). Notice that “Loiza” is wearing flats while the woman is wearing heels, yet “Loiza” towers over her anyway. Look at the difference in shoulder size. In fact, notice how almost everything is significantly larger — head, mouth, feet, shoulders, etc.
Here is another one: https://www.instagram.com/p/BXaAg0SljT8/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
Notice the obvious lack of hips. When a genetic woman places her hand on her hip, there’s a hip there and it’s quite noticeable. “Loiza” doesn’t have that because that isn’t a genetic woman. Here’s another example: https://www.instagram.com/p/BVetmlJFi5Y/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link
Anyway, you get the point. Even “Loiza” has tells, and that person works as a fashion model, and therefore knows how to present/hide things more than average, and “gets away with” being taller and lower body fat than most genetic girls (because fashion models are like that even if they are genetic girls).
@Paul
”What I find truly disturbing is the whole “chick with dicks” subculture, where men are actually looking for them. Will the church:
a. classify them as homosexuals?
b. classify them as healthy man-woman relationships?”
The only difference is a mutilated modified male or a non-mutiliated modified male. Its homosexuality regardless.
@Dave @Paul
Agreed.
Also, on our friend “Loiza” … it’s actually easier, I think, for a certain kind of trans (and that person is one of them) to pass as a fashion model than as a regular woman. Why? Because fashion models are already outliers among genetic women — they’re almost all much taller, skinnier, lankier, angular than the typical, “normal” woman is (even a very beautiful “normal” woman who is not built like a fashion model). This is one of the reasons women have been complaining forever about the fashion industry and its “beauty standards” because regular women are not similar in size and shape to fashion models. If we add trans into the mix, that becomes even more the case, because of course these aren’t even women, and yet they are being held up as beauty examples for genetic women — if that catches on to any significant degree, we will hear screeching about it from women, and for good reason.
Of course underlying all of this is that the fashion industry is dominated by gay men.
The freak show continues.. I’ll just go MGTOW.
@Sharkly
Hilarious.
@Novaseeker
What about looking at their eyes? I have heard that trans have a “Strong” Look in their eyes that genetic women don’t have.
@Novaseeker
It shows that it’s getting more difficult to quickly discern the sex a person was born with.
And what’s typically absent from any discussion on gender identity, including homosexuality and transgenderism, is the question on the ability to have children.
What’s often pushed is either adoption, or one of the partners actually mating with a 3rd party, and hence bring in a child in the relationship.
Once homosexuality or transgenderism is accepted, people often quietly accept the situation with children.
@Paul
Plus what occurs with trans M-to-F is that their testicles get removed and their “thing” gets turned inside out creating a wound that needed to be constantly opened where their genital used to be.
@Spike
Who will miss it though? Who watches women’s sports?
This is in my mind a case in point. I stopped watching UFC when Dana caved and started adding chick fights to the tickets. Now some of the chicks in the octagon aren’t really chicks trying to be like men, but men pretending to be women. But I still won’t watch it.
Granted, I’m not big into watching sports. I certainly watch far less than the average man.
Indeed Paul. There are giveaways if one takes the time to discern them and compare them to a feminine women. However, compare them to an average modern women and the lines can get blurred quite quickly.
The video of the trans model with the hula hoop doesn’t have direct tell signs. The face looks feminine, the only giveaway for me is the lack pronounced hips and hour glass shape, otherwise she looks like a tall and thin model. Whilst the tall and thin model walking down the runway has always been unattractive to me, I would not immediately be able to tell the difference between this trans and the runway girl anyway.
“I still think there’s enough of an “ick” factor to prevent churchian pastors from urging men to marry MtF trans.”
There is an ick factor for homosexual activity too. At least in my case, I experience physical nausea at the thought of committing a sexual act with a male (including acts I would happily participate in with a woman). I believe this is biologically hardwired in (to promote species reproduction & survival), rather than socialization. If anything, it has to be socialized out of a person.
It shows that it’s getting more difficult to quickly discern the sex a person was born with.
Only on the margins. Fashion models are outlier looking women to begin with, so a pretty faced trans can fit in more easily there than a less pretty one with the same build would in normal society.
I do think that as we have more and more trans doing the switch as teenagers (puberty blockers and the like, so never developing any secondary sex characteristics of their biological sex), it will become harder to tell. It will be interesting to see, once we have a significant sample size of such people, what the outcomes are in terms of the “tells”. Up to now, though, most trans are people who “transitioned” long after puberty and have secondary sex characteristics that are tells.
There are plenty of men who watch the volleyball, gymnastics and other such sports simply because it often contains pretty young women who are fit and in their prime.
I mean, who can forget the women tennis stars who get paid oodles more for their modeling gigs than their tennis performances.
Men might not be tuning in to watch the serena sisters win matches or throw hissy fits, but they sure are tuning in to watch the hot Russian and Eastern European women make orgasm noises as they hit the ball back and forth.
As I’ve mentioned before, we have a tranny at the office (a large multinational tech firm). I can assure you that no one mistakes this dude for a woman. And while most of my coworkers virtue signal about how progressive they are, they all pretty much shun the tranny.
Tucker Max on how more than a few straight guys have unknowingly had sex with transsexuals:
http://tuckermax.com/stories/the-most-disturbing-conversation-ever/
(Scroll to “Part Two”)
JRob — “From what I can gather in limited Flyoverville, the lowest rung is firmly occupied by white male veterans with VA disability ratings.”
You gather pretty good.
Outside of entertainers and sex workers, I think most transsexuals are still pretty unappealing. It’s unlikely you’ll be beguiled by one unknowingly.
Over time, I’ve witnessed the male to female transformation of a person where I get my groceries and another one at Target. Both went from being high-talking men in women’s clothes and hairstyles to strange-looking people in women’s clothes with less facial hair and less forced high voices. A young acquaintance is changing into a man. She and most others I encountered as a bank teller start and end as a puffy, unattractive, gender nonspecific creature not unlike SNL’s “Pat” character.
And if you’re really in doubt, by their fruits (sorry) you will know them. I have not encountered one LGBTQ+ person who was not plagued by a life of chaos and disorder, often also addiction.
Most cross dressers/trans-folk where I’m from look like the Founding Fathers, not “Loiza.”
The one’s who do “pass” have to get not only breast, but also butt implants too.
This whole trans movement is just a scam to get straight guys to have sex with gay men. If it were really a thing, then more than 2% of “trans” men would get their genitals changed.
This is maddening. To me, this is just spearhead of the true goal. Sex is universal and is about as objective as we can get. If our certainty about sex can be undermined, then there will be no way justify personal judgement on any human behavior. I see this as the primary problem of the church as well. What is the role of individual judgement to a christian … or anyone one who professes to love?
San Francisco Creates World’s First Ever Transgender Cultural District
https://www.thedailybeast.com/san-francisco-creates-worlds-first-ever-transgender-cultural-district
@citizen1 If our certainty about sex can be undermined, then there will be no way justify personal judgement on any human behavior.
To me it’s clear there’s an all-out war on God, more specifically on the symbols that exist to deeply teach us about aspects of God: God as a your Father, God as a Son, God as a Husband. And as all totalitarian governments also understood: if you can destroy the core family of husband-wife and their children, you can completely control society.
That’s why I think in the NT explicitly sexual immorality is singled out as OT requirement that needs to be specifically avoided, as it eventually destroys families.
It is therefore appalling that the church has almost without any pushback accepted feminism (anti-patriarchy, anti-male), divorce (anti-marriage), homosexuality (anti-gender), pre-marital sex (anti-marriage), (trans)genderism (anti-gender). and remarriage after divorce (anti-marriage).
Jean,
It depends. I knew one in the past who looked like a knock out gorgeous blonde. I knew another who looked pretty bad.
I did find it quite ironic that both grew big beards before going through the procedure. It showed the gender confusion that was under it all.
Its a good point. Like today–women have short shoulder lenth hair. So we guys are sporting buzz cuts and other very short styles.
Some people of course have quit and are fugly whales, but trannies, and the media acting like trannies are 30% of the populace just as they did with gays, will shift styles to make women want to be definitely female.
BillyS, even more than gender confusion I think is just general confusion. The young woman I know who is “becoming” a male is truly mentally ill and has a long history of self-harm, suicide attempts, and substance abuse that’s put her in and out of rehabs and psychiatric programs. She’s been a lesbian for a long time. Now she’s been sold a bill of goods that transitioning to a man will solve all her problems. I feel like she’s a poster child/guinea pig for someone’s transgender agenda. Don’t think I’ll be shocked when all her hormone therapy and surgeries are completed and she’s no more mentally healthy than she ever was. I certainly don’t wish her ill, but I expect her to take her own life at some point. Seems like sex-change surgery is the latest panacea.
I don’t share your optimism. The answer from straight women will be more nudity. This tracks with what you’ve seen of men. Women will no more take up a quiet and gentle spirit to signal their sexuality anymore than men show their manliness by prayer and lifting holy hands. These things don’t cause attraction in our society.
Novaseeker — “Of course underlying all of this is that the fashion industry is dominated by gay men.”
Homos, you mean. Like that alt.right hero from a few years back — Milo. Homos.
The Fashion Industry contains no joyful men, and it’s a concession to adopt the vernacular of your enemies.
This is a brilliant post, and an angle I had not considered.
I await the opportunity to tell a feminist, with a straight and sincere face, that I think she should be able to use whatever restroom ‘people like her’ identify with.
I don’t know about looking more feminine, but trans acceptance should be enough to trigger women’s disgust reflex:
View at Medium.com
@Warthog I agree with your prediction. Women won’t swing to the feminine. I am starting to see young men wear nail polish…my guess is they are straight men. My prediction is in the future more men than women will wear makeup. I hope I am wrong about that but that’s where I see things going.
“She’s been a lesbian for a long time. Now she’s been sold a bill of goods that transitioning to a man will solve all her problems.”
This is why there is a major fault line developing on the left between gays and trans.
1: Is a lesbian a trans man who hasn’t transitioned yet, and is a gay man actually a trans woman who hasn’t transitioned yet?
2: Is a lesbian a woman who is sexually attracted to women, and a gay man simply a man who is sexually attracted to men?
Trans: 1=yes, 2=no.
Gay: 1=no, 2=yes.
There is the flamer issue. Who wants a woman who reminds them of the flamer they’ve worked with all day?
Extending my last post, more on the trans/gay split:
“The term “TERF” is short for “trans exclusionary radical feminist”. The term is used by trans advocates to describe feminists who oppose the inclusion of trans women in female spaces and organizations, whereas those it is applied to see it as a mischaracterization of their positions and a slur.”
More on the TERF wars:
View at Medium.com
For many decades the trend has been for women to ape men, starting at least in the 1920s with Amelia Earhart and her peers.
There’s a lot more to her story than we’re being told…
https://seesdifferent.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/amelbf.jpg?w=500&h=326
[D: Hilarious!]
@Danny If it’s a real woman I would appreciate her femininity. She would be far superior to the majority of today’s women who look like men. The flamer is a dude and will always be a dude…I’m not going to let him change my taste in women.
Whether the prisoners believed her to be a woman or a transgender man, she was safe locked up for 10 hours with 40 male prisoners! Kind of goes against the idea that she wouldn’t be alive by the next morning…
Where is my friend RedpillLatecomer for a good laugh? 😏
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/opinion-men-me-too-workplace-harassment-code_us_5c0ae9eae4b035a7bf5b2060
Slightly OT. So I was talked into a the starting module for RZIM Academy and I have been following along for weeks on the enthusiasm I’ve had for John Lennox and Ravi Zecharias. Little things bugging me but I was able to hold my nose. Then I get to a lecture by an Oxford Doctor of Philosophy Amy Orr-Ewing where she claims that we’ve been misinterpreting Deuteronomy 20 for years and that God didn’t really want Joshua to kill all of those child sacrificing pedophiles. (Oh and by the way the Old Testament isn’t xenophobic because Moses married a Cushite). Needless to say when I posted to their forum I got a negative “tone” vote.
Another feminist attack on “toxic masculinity” under the guise of apologetics.
Fortunately the video is behind a paywall so you can’t see it for yourself. In my opinion RZIM Academy looks like it’s being eaten inside out by postmodernists and their pay model with the lack of forum participation was not as advertised. I think it’s scammy as Hell. Be warned.
“The term “TERF” is short for “trans exclusionary radical feminist”. The term is used by trans advocates to describe feminists who oppose the inclusion of trans women in female spaces and organizations, whereas those it is applied to see it as a mischaracterization of their positions and a slur.”
This fight arises primarily from the fact that a significantly high percentage of male to female trans are attracted to women — that is, the “identify as lesbian” even though they, like the overwhelming majority of trans, do not have surgery on their genitals. So, the fight is this. If “trans women are women!!”, which the LGBT movement’s endorsed trans slogan, is correct, then it’s bigoted for lesbians to not consider trans women to be women for purposes of sex and relationships. The lesbians who object are saying “trans women are trans, they are not vagina-possessing women, so we are not interested in them”, to which the trans women reply “you’re a bigot!!!” (the standard criticism of everyone who disagrees with trans ideology). It does, however, logically follow from the slogan that “trans women are women” (remember the slogan doesn’t say “trans women are trans women”).
One of the real misunderstandings of a lot of people is that trans women all get surgery on their genitals (most don’t) and that trans women are basically gay men who want to act more effeminate. Many of them are attracted to women, which is why they are running into problems with lesbians — they want access to lesbian spaces, to lesbian women for dates and sex and so on.
This is mostly an issue on the lesbian side, because unlike male to female trans, female to male trans mostly identify as lesbian and are attracted to women (and the lesbian community more or less accepts them because they *are* women biologically). There isn’t a groundswell of female to male trans trying to access gay male spaces. However, on the other side, there are a lot of female-attracted trans who are trying to LARP as lesbians, essentially, and this is creating the conflict.
It’s fun to watch when the left eats itself like this.
@GIL
I am sorry to hear a second poor report of Ravi Zacharias’ ministry. He has before faithfully preached Christ.
Novaseeker, your last post was very confusing, but not because of any lack of clarity in your writing; it was just hard to keep up with who was a man or woman or whathaveyou.
Novaseeker, your last post was very confusing, but not because of any lack of clarity in your writing; it was just hard to keep up with who was a man or woman or whathaveyou.
Yeah I know. The trans stuff is like “through the looking glass” really. Is a genetic woman who becomes a trans man but is attracted to women a lesbian? Straight? Same on the other side. It’s where the homosexual ideology buts up against the gender ideology, and it leads to a lot of confusion on all sides I think.
@Heidi
There is an easy way to navigate the terms. Just remember that “trans” means “not”.
@GIS
”Then I get to a lecture by an Oxford Doctor of Philosophy Amy Orr-Ewing where she claims that we’ve been misinterpreting Deuteronomy 20 for years and that God didn’t really want Joshua to kill all of those child sacrificing pedophiles.”
Or their genetics may have been compromised.
http://drmsh.com/the-giant-clans-and-the-conquest/
Especially the Amalekites too.
@Novaseeker
Those transgenders have allegedly been sexually assaulting female prisoners:
https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2018/10/11/allegedly-transgender-prisoner-life-raping-assaulting-women-female-jail/
Look at the absurdity of such a paragraph:
“The complainant, while waiting, felt something hard press against the small of her back,” he said. “She turned around to see the defendant stood there. She could see the defendant’s penis erect and sticking out of the top of her pants, covered by her tights.”
Nick, the HuffPo article is just the same old “man up.” Yet another attempt to shame men into doing what women want.
Articles says there’s no need to hide from women. It’s easy to avoid being charged with sexual harassment. Just don’t sexually harass.
Article completely ignores the possibility of false sexual harassment allegations.
I wish I would have seen a warning.
Class started with 100, 3 active on the forum. My wife’s class started at the same time, also with 100 and she claims that her participation rate is even lower. A bunch of English as a second language types who just can’t keep up. Leaving me to wonder is this a mid level English class with me as a tutor or a course on apologetics.
Was the other person you’re referring to a person contact or an online one? I’d like to see other feedback officiel italien out there.
That is: I’d like to see other feedback if it’s out there.
@Luke
That article also allowed another tell for a tranny:
Trannies couldn’t naturally lubricate. Hence if its dry then one has to assume that its a mutilated male.
”He went on to explain that some post-op transsexuals will go to the bathroom before sex, and put the KY(lubricant) in without even telling the guy.”
Yikes.
Nick Mgtow says:
December 11, 2018 at 5:40 pm
Where is my friend RedpillLatecomer for a good laugh?
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/opinion-men-me-too-workplace-harassment-code_us_5c0ae9eae4b035a7bf5b2060
I for one am waiting for the author, Tahir Duckett to get ensnared in a #Metoo.
Dalrock says:
December 11, 2018 at 8:49 am
@Spike
The 4Chan guys got it right: Men are better at everything, including being women.
We will now have a mess at the Olympics, as the trannies will dominate every woman’s sport. That will make it not worth watching.
Who will miss it though? Who watches women’s sports?
The UFC will have to accommodate more Fallon Fox-es, making more men win and endangering XX women in the process.
This is in my mind a case in point. I stopped watching UFC when Dana caved and started adding chick fights to the tickets. Now some of the chicks in the octagon aren’t really chicks trying to be like men, but men pretending to be women. But I still won’t watch it.
Granted, I’m not big into watching sports. I certainly watch far less than the average man.
Dalrock:
Thanks for your reply. What I’m getting at is that this ”LGBTIQ / Trans-” agenda is being driven by a bunch of elites. They are elites because they seem to have a lot of power: they can tell governments to drop gendered pronouns in speech; they can tell governments to drop ‘M/F’ from birth certificates.
Those same elites have playthings: Bread and Circus Acts designed to distract and entertain. Those playthings also make them a lot of money and power.
One of those playthings is the Olympic Games. Since Montreal 1976, corporate sponsorship has ensured that the Olympics doesn’t make a country go bust hosting the Games, thus making them an attractive, money-making proposition. Corporate sponsorship in turn, relies on TV rights, which means a watching public that will also buy corporate products.
Young, fit women are still an Olympic drawcard. As corporate sponsorship grew, female athletes have gotten increasingly more glamorous. Should you watch Olympic coverage from the 1960s and 1970s for example, female athletes were dowdy with daggy uniforms and unshaved limbs. They actually cared for their performances rather than their looks. Not so now.
When the Olympics is turned into a LGBTIQ freak show and the bulk of people will stop watching them, there will be a loss of corporate dollars and sponsorship. Governments will be loathe to host the Games due to the financial burden, making them increasingly unsustainable.
Ditto the UFC. As a fight trainer, I am aware that the UFC took a massive hit when women got on the ticket. It’s still big, because fighting women are still a drawcard to Blue Pill men (I don’t know why: up close they are damaged goods). Seeing these same women getting their heads smashed by trannies will make those same Blue Pillers drop off the viewership.
@ Novaseeker. That is so confusing I think I just found out I’m a lesbian ! I feel triggered all sudden I need safe space
I hope your title happens, Dalrock. My world’s shittiness has been accelerating for a while and I want it to stop.
Gents, you’re missing a fairly obvious solution to all this ambiguity…GROW YOUR BEARDS OUT! Not a perfect solution. Think of it as low hanging fruit for those to recover their masculinity in a #metoo world.
For too long even straight, conservative men have been shaving their beards, looking like “very young men and bridegrooms and having the face of women.” If natural beards were the cultural norm it would remove a lot of ambiguity and confusion as only females or those presenting as female wouldn’t have a beard. The notable exception, of course, being a FtM trans who takes hormones just to be able to grow a beard.
But think about it. Other than the FtM types, no woman would bother. MtF trans work hard to get rid of their facial hair. Your average blue-haired, overweight feminist isn’t going to put in the effort to hormone their way into a beard. That just leaves the blokes. Beards are our birthright, our lion’s mane.
Having gone full Duck Dynasty myself (albeit with a little more product than those guys probably use), i can say it has changed the way I look at men. I still respect clean shaven men who are known for their masculinity. Yet whenever I see somebody like Dee Snider or R. Lee Ermy looking all badass, I can’t help but think to myself, “that guy would still look so much better with a beard.”
And when I see an old man without a beard, especially if he is soft or despicable in some way, I think he looks like an old, haggard woman (think Michael Moore). Once you’ve been a beardsman for a bit, clean shaven men start to look a little like Mrs. Doubtfire.
Not saying go full Gandalf but guys, grow a nice academic beard or a goatee if you can. Even a pencil thin mustache will get the job done. You convey masculine authority on a biological level and you make it harder for gender benders to muddy the waters.
@GIL
It was here. Sam Allberry–an English pastor Dalrock has referenced several times in these last few posts –is a speaker for RZIM.
I didn’t mean for his twitter feed to appear; only to link to it.
I can’t stand a beard. I gets too much of my focus, as does any facial hair (or head hair now for that matter, except for eyebrows). Growing a beard works for some, but it would bother me to no end and not worth it.
====
God didn’t tell Israel to kill all foreigners, only those in the area they were taking over. That is why they did the agreement with the one group before even asking God. Don’t use that to justify killing foreigners now. Plenty of other Scriptures talk about how God made the nations to support that without anything else needed.
Gents, you’re missing a fairly obvious solution to all this ambiguity…GROW YOUR BEARDS OUT!
I can tell you haven’t been near a college campus lately. The 20-something men are doing just that.
Unfortunately it is very easy to be a bearded man who can’t see well due to Blue Pill glasses.
Spike says:
I for one am waiting for the author, Tahir Duckett to get ensnared in a #Metoo.
Now, that would be funny!
@anon… Big up to the college guys then! Although I’m perfectly aware that the blue pilled types aren’t always the most masculine fellows. Not a panacea, just a step in the right direction that most men can take.
For me it’s a bird in hand. A small thing that I can do to try and reclaim some power in an age where men have none. I don’t have to stick my neck out saying controversial things. I don’t have to say anything. My beard speaks for itself (because it’s way badass).
They can take our sports, our media, our video games, our masculine spaces, our families, our money, or our sense of identity. But they can’t take our beards without shaving us or at least shaming us. Why do you think beards are currently associated with weak soy boys? So that reasonable men won’t want to grow them perhaps?
It’s a last bit of friendly territory in the war against men. Part of a complete, nutritious manosphere breakfast.
I think this is already the case, Notice how fewer and fewer cities are bidding on hosting the Olympics. What will they do when no one bids? Expect some Chinese city to ride to the rescue?
In two words -I hope!
Linking back to Dalrock’s essay above, rather than the comments:
The tragedy of the Dominican lady in Miami was as likely as not a direct consequence of the law cited by the Dallas County farce. (Title of address modified to reflect reality, and emphasis added.)
So if the Jack-ass in Texas had not had the so-called “Prison Rape Elimination Act” on the Federal books to cite, the woman in Florida might have been treated with dignity and decency, outstanding drug charges or not.
About the beard thing… it used to be standard for men to grow a beard. You kind of had to, as shaving was a lot more difficult and time consuming. A clean shaven face became more of the norm during WW1, when soldiers had to shave to get a good seal on their gas mask. Then Gillette came out with the safety razor. And the rest is history…
About the beard thing… it used to be standard for men to grow a beard. You kind of had to, as shaving was a lot more difficult and time consuming.
Beards come and go across time, as all fashions do. In some historical periods such as ancient Rome most men were clean shaven. In other times and places beards were the norm. Sometimes of necessity, such as in 5th Century AD, sometimes for other reasons as in later eras of 1,000 AD. It is also a cultural thing, such as in parts of the Middle East where a man without a beard is regarded as less of a man.
In the US the Founding generation of the 18th century were virtually all clean shaven (Washington, Jefferson, Franklin, Adams, etc.), whereas in the 19th century a beard of some sort was the norm.
It’s a fashion. If young men of the current year persist in beards into their 40’s, perhaps clean shaven will return among their sons.
“@GIL
I am sorry to hear a second poor report of Ravi Zacharias’ ministry. He has before faithfully preached Christ.”
This person Zacharias is not to be trusted.
Ravi Zacharias always came across as a light weight and more motivational speaker minded.
Stick with the abstract thinkers (some would say autistic) that don’t give a fuck what other people say if the logic still holds true, “I’m sorry, but that’s not an argument”. William Lane Craig, Greg Koukl, Vox Day, Stefan Molyneux. You can think they might be wrong but they are more consistent in general and layout their reasons.
Interesting remarks in this documentary at the 27″- 29″ mark.
Women in biker gangs wear “property” patches. “Property of Jimmy” etc. More women want to be biker property than there are bikers available.
Another example of women seeking dominance by an Alpha, rather than seeking a nice, sensitive man who does laundry.
I have never gotten the desire of men to have beards, now that we have easy ways to shave. Not only is personal hygiene improved, there is IMO a deeper, darker issue. In a time when most men are sexually starving, and order is breaking down, why would any man not inclined to be a homosexual “bottom” want to increase how easily his mouth could be mistaken for a woman’s nether regions, unless that was one of his secret hopes? (That not being one of mine, I’m clean-shaven.)
Anyone interested in reading essays about M-F transsexuals whining that no one wants to have sex with them, search using the term “cotton ceiling”.
The angle of the elbow is much larger in women and something that is both impossible to correct, difficult to conceal as well as unknown to most people. It is a simple way to tell the sexes apart which you can easily learn. What strikes me about the story is that this was the failure of a female nurse to do her job, yet a male policeman who was left with no alternative is portrayed as the bad guy.
Luke: I have never gotten the desire of men to have beards … why would any man not inclined to be a homosexual “bottom” want to increase how easily his mouth could be mistaken for a woman’s nether regions, unless that was one of his secret hopes?
Huh?
I’ve had a beard my whole life. In the 1980s, when most men were clean-shaven. In the 1990s, when goatees were the thing. In the 2000s, when “five o’clock shadows” suddenly became fashionable. And to this day.
I don’t think anyone ever mistook my mouth for a woman’s nether regions.
As I’ve told others, I didn’t grow a beard. I didn’t do anything. God did all the work. He chose to put a beard on my face. Who am I to argue?
Red Pill Latecomer, by that logic, using soap (to say nothing of deodorant) is equally unnatural. So, I take it you never, ever use either one of those, then.
@Red Pill Latecomer,
He’s a troll. Ignore him.
Otto, I have been posting off and on Dalrock’s site for over 7 years. I don’t remember even seeing you post before. I am serious in all my posts, and am perfectly willing and able to defend them.
Frankly, I believe that currently large Moses beards are mainly worn by those men on the fringes of normal society — bikers, leftists, polygamist offshoots of Mormonism, Muslims, hippies, etc. For that matter, men who prefer women totally shaved “down there” IMO have some pedo tendencies they’re not honest to the world about (just like those men who prefer sub-C-cup women). Non-PC? Yep. Defensible, too.
Ruth Ginsberg, presently sitting on the Supreme Court of the United States, has always advocated that males and females should be housed together in jails and prisons calling it a form of discrimination for them to be housed separately.
This may be the only point of hers I agree with. *grin*.
@Luke : For that matter, men who prefer women totally shaved “down there” IMO have some pedo tendencies they’re not honest to the world about
Geez, where is that coming from in a discussion on beards! And you claim to be serious in all your posts? Really?
Paul, it’s on-topic, as the (sub) topic the thread has devolved to is shaving as appropriate or not.
Certainly, women in the U.S. should shave their armpits. The French have lower standards for their women, alas.
A silver lining to U.S. women now often visually enabling closet pedos is that certain parasite (crabs, some lice that like genitals, etc.) are less common now, due to chicks shaving down there.
@Luke
I looked through the whole thread, and no one but you was talking about anything else but shaving beards.
And I find the woman-shaving-down-under association to pedophilia ridiculous.
By the same token, so is shaving your armpits, and so is shaving your beard.
Luke, you are a huge, tormented homosexual. Haha, you assuming that everybody else (like you) looks at a man’s beard and thinks it looks like a women’s vagina — wow, you really told more about yourself than you think. I have never, ever heard anyone else ever think or say that. Bet you look at guys drinking through straws and think of blowjobs. In fact, I bet everything about men makes you think of sex.